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Kick and Bass Headroom General Rule
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Psydust
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
14
Posts :
91
Posted : Nov 27, 2009 07:27
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very interesting article, i wonder what are the appropriate compression settings regarding attack and delay are for lets say 145 bpm record. i always knew they are short, but how much exactly? would it be fair to say that attack should be at minimal and release at around 164 miliseconds? is there a way to calculate release time based on the speed of the track or is it done solely by ears..
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Speakafreaka
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
18
Posts :
779
Posted : Nov 27, 2009 12:40
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I'd say it is more dependant on feel rather than tempo.
I don't think there is any easy way to determine it apart from learning what sounds good and what doesn't which is a bit trial and error.
In terms of timing I disagree with the article - I'll typically go circa 1-5ms attack (their suggestion is really really slow!) and circa 100-150ms on the release - of course, all depending on vibe of the track.
Jizy, I tend to go with a vintage URS unit - reckon it depends how you want your mix to sound - clear and transparent? Probably something like Oxford Dynamics. A bit twitchy around the edges? Probably URS 1970.
In terms of levels - I check the RMS of my mix before the compressor and set the threshold to just slightly higher than that. Ratio I keep very low at 1:5 to around 2. The aim isn't really compression here, in many ways  Its more about making your mix dynamics 'sympathetic' to the character of the track. It is a very subtle effect at the end of the day.
I made an A/B comparison for another forum where I was talking in more depth about it which might be amusing (all mixed on headphones so forgive wonkiness) - I even phase invert it, so you can hear the difference! It is a very subtle effect http://www.sendspace.com/file/j73lu5 .
http://www.soundcloud.com/speakafreaka |
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
162
Posts :
8087
Posted : Nov 27, 2009 16:43
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Quote:
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On 2009-11-26 12:13, jizy wrote:
What are the best comps for mixing onto the main buss?
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my favorite right now is duende x-comp ,you can compress a lot more than usual plugins with it ,8 db it still sound good (offcourse it s too much and sound flat but the sound is still musical )mostly hardware comps does that. for native plugins maybe try the old sonalksis or the sonnox |
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jizy
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
90
Posts :
1493
Posted : Nov 27, 2009 17:36
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Il try sonaklisis, what about dynamic eq's on the main channel? Like the sonaklsis ones? Anyone use dynamic eq's?
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Nectarios
Martian Arts
Started Topics :
187
Posts :
5292
Posted : Nov 27, 2009 18:54
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One more thing I wanna add in this thread, that some newer producers should think about before starting to search and splash out on expensive exotic mastering plug ins...I don't use any special mastering tools, to sort out mixes.
I used to think that's what made the difference with the proper pro polished stuff, but its not. As time went by I started paying more attention to the mixdowns, arrangements and individual parts that caused problems that I thought I just needed "that" special expensive limiter/compressor, in order to sort out. But it was just a case of carefull EQing, moving channel faders a bit more, especially moving/muting/filtering synth parts that were causing a mess when playing together, and slowly everything started to sound a lot better.
I am not saying a good mastering suite won't help making things louder (and iron out small mix mistakes) than I could ever do in my studio, but I was (still am) far from getting the perfect mixdowns and arrangements, in order to start looking for the "perfect" mastering tools/technics.
So give a lot more attention to the mixdowns, individual channel EQing and arrangement, before you go thinking tunes that sound proper slamming, do so becaus eof the mastering.
http://soundcloud.com/martianarts |
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jizy
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
90
Posts :
1493
Posted : Nov 27, 2009 23:09
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Na man I've already been down that road with synths. Vst can do just as good.
I'm happy with waves, psp,sonaklsis and The mighty URS.
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Obelizk
Amoeba
Started Topics :
115
Posts :
836
Posted : Nov 27, 2009 23:21
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Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
60
Posts :
3709
Posted : Nov 28, 2009 01:33
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Quote:
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On 2009-11-27 23:21, Obelizk wrote:
Doesn't anyone use multiband compression on their masters? or just standard compression?
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Till now I only use multiband compression on sounds like certain basses that needs to be compressed in the lowend but not the highend..
or are too vivid in the mix... But its a fine line as i think with the wrong settings it can blurr the sound..
though i dont know! as with every tool it has it place..
My knowledge on compressing is not that well
I wish to learn more on what to listen for when compressing...
i think its a great idea to start with a simple fullband compressor and then AB as you go, then you can also figure out if its multiband you need on certain sounds or not
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jizy
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
90
Posts :
1493
Posted : Nov 28, 2009 03:14
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Quote:
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On 2009-11-28 01:33, Freeflow wrote:
Quote:
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On 2009-11-27 23:21, Obelizk wrote:
Doesn't anyone use multiband compression on their masters? or just standard compression?
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Till now I only use multiband compression on sounds like certain basses that needs to be compressed in the lowend but not the highend..
or are too vivid in the mix... But its a fine line as i think with the wrong settings it can blurr the sound..
though i dont know! as with every tool it has it place..
My knowledge on compressing is not that well
I wish to learn more on what to listen for when compressing...
i think its a great idea to start with a simple fullband compressor and then AB as you go, then you can also figure out if its multiband you need on certain sounds or not
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why not just use a low shelf or alter the low band using quadrafuzz?
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Elad
Tsabeat/Sattel Battle
Started Topics :
158
Posts :
5306
Posted : Nov 28, 2009 03:39
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Quote:
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On 2009-11-27 23:21, Obelizk wrote:
Doesn't anyone use multiband compression on their masters? or just standard compression?
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one of the must tools for not perfect mixes imo
btw the hole volume thingy is true if you going to make Kbbb pattern but one you have the bass playing all 16th notes the kick can go to half volume and be even fatter then before
dont push both too much if you do this and probably abit of sidechain to bass eq can solve some problems too..
www.sattelbattle.com
http://yoavweinberg.weebly.com/ |
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Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
60
Posts :
3709
Posted : Nov 28, 2009 03:52
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Quote:
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On 2009-11-28 03:14, jizy wrote:
Quote:
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On 2009-11-28 01:33, Freeflow wrote:
Quote:
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On 2009-11-27 23:21, Obelizk wrote:
Doesn't anyone use multiband compression on their masters? or just standard compression?
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Till now I only use multiband compression on sounds like certain basses that needs to be compressed in the lowend but not the highend..
or are too vivid in the mix... But its a fine line as i think with the wrong settings it can blurr the sound..
though i dont know! as with every tool it has it place..
My knowledge on compressing is not that well
I wish to learn more on what to listen for when compressing...
i think its a great idea to start with a simple fullband compressor and then AB as you go, then you can also figure out if its multiband you need on certain sounds or not
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why not just use a low shelf or alter the low band using quadrafuzz?
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ill try some low shelfing, though i usually do it my self by cutting to a point where i find a good compromise of presence without too much click... But i should deffo try some low shelf, might do wonders,
yeah i often forget quadrafuzz, its a great one, someone once told me two instances of it on Vb1 and you got that sound.... hehe
But what i meant here was compressing only the lowend leaving the highs untouched..
If the lowend is too flabby..
Though i guess you can make your own "band compression" with same technique as de-essing? we call it de-booming... haha just kidding, but is it possible?
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Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
60
Posts :
3709
Posted : Nov 28, 2009 03:57
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maybe its more like using the
multiband compressor as dynamic eq
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jizy
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
90
Posts :
1493
Posted : Nov 28, 2009 08:24
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Then again I've never been Successful using a multiand comp.. not yet, but with the right experience and adaption u could make wonderess basslines I rekon
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Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
60
Posts :
3709
Posted : Nov 28, 2009 09:30
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Speakafreaka
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
18
Posts :
779
Posted : Nov 28, 2009 10:36
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One thing I wouldn't suggest doing is mixing into a multiband on the master out, although technically I suppose there is no reason why one shouldn't ... its just, well, I'm used to thinking of MB Comps as either subtle corrective devices for mixes at the mastering stage, or powerful single instrument manipulators where you can really alter the characteristics of something.
Mixing into a multiband would be like admitting defeat ... like one knew the mix was gonna be wrong before the mix has happened. Also, to really set up a multiband compressor so it sounds great and not like it is killing the audio ... is less easy than people think. It is very easy to totally overdo it!
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http://www.soundcloud.com/speakafreaka |
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