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Is their really a need for all that hardware?
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NeutroN
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Nov 20, 2003 19:59
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This may be a very stupid question, but whatever lol 
With all these new VSTs and soft that are coming out almost everyday, is their really a need for any hardware apart from a good soundcard and monitors? if yes which I probably think is the answer, how much do you think is REALLY needed? and which hardware today do you think could easily be substituted by a soft?
  "Great things are only possible with outrageous requests." Thea Alexander |
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billy ambulance
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Nov 20, 2003 20:41
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a lot of artist work even without a pro sound-card but a person who like progress will get himslef a Hardware synth,Mixer, compressor, efects.
I personally think that no soft-synth can produce the power that the nord or virus produces and if you`ll listen to shpongle`s reverbs you`ll understand that no software made that!
check out! www.soundclick.com/spasm |
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Pavel
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Posted : Nov 20, 2003 20:44
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Quote:
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On 2003-11-20 20:41, billy ambulance wrote:
a lot of artist work even without a pro sound-card but a person who like progress will get himslef a Hardware synth,Mixer, compressor, efects.
I personally think that no soft-synth can produce the power that the nord or virus produces and if you`ll listen to shpongle`s reverbs you`ll understand that no software made that!
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barf
all those Virtual Analog synths are nothing more than little computers with software.
If you want something that won't be easily emulated than go for the vintage Analog synths and Efx.
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solipt1c
Soliptic
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Posted : Nov 20, 2003 21:56
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in theory the answer is that only the following hardware is 'unemulatable':
monitors, midi controller, I/O, mic+pres , real analog gear (arguably)
however hardware can usually do 'better'- some cases the software is less high-quality, or perhaps it can be just as high-quality, but not real-time , or else real-time, but so powerful that u have no cpu left for anything else.
like pavel said all modern hardware is just software running on its own chips ...
perhaps real analog gear will be never be truly emulated... but then when we start physical modelling at the atomic level who knows.
other than that its really just how much your computer can do and how much you'd rather take the strain off it and give to a dedicated tool.
http://www.dartrecordings.co.uk/ |
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Pavel
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Posted : Nov 20, 2003 23:42
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On 2003-11-20 21:56, solipt1c wrote:
but then when we start physical modelling at the atomic level who knows.
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The problem is not the quality of emulation!!! The true uniqueness of the analog sound is it's imperfection. The frequency drifts are the ones that create the "fat" sound. This is the part where the "problemm" lies. The digital sound is too sterile, lifeless. The analog sound rounds the edges. While the analog distortion is a beauty, the digital one is not more than hi-freq noise.
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NeutroN
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Nov 21, 2003 01:08
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Pavel, I see where you are coming from the "imperfection" means that the same 2 synth can have different sounds right?
"Great things are only possible with outrageous requests." Thea Alexander |
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Pavel
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Posted : Nov 21, 2003 01:41
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On 2003-11-21 01:08, NeutroN wrote:
Pavel, I see where you are coming from the "imperfection" means that the same 2 synth can have different sounds right?
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Analog ones, in theory cannot play the same sound even if the knobs are set in the exact way.
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solipt1c
Soliptic
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Posted : Nov 21, 2003 01:42
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> The true uniqueness of the analog sound is it's imperfection
pavel - yes, so we emulate that too, whats your point?
in fact already vstis emulate this 'oscillator' drift.
http://www.dartrecordings.co.uk/ |
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FluoSamsara (Oxygen)
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Nov 21, 2003 02:10
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Yeah, I think harware can just give the power that vsts cant...I use a nord L 2, and although I write a LOT of stuff with vsts in the end I always end up recording them with the nord!
Plus, with a hardware its the hardware doing the sound processing, not the cpu...so you save loads of precious memory...
Also fx, well, those ones like compressors and other dynamic tools, vsts are simply not up for such a good job as the hardware...yet...
And also...its just sooo much fun to twist the knobs with your hands instead of with the mouse!
But yes, some softs have the power to make amazing sounds, e.g I think reaktor is just amazing, but it takes so much memory!
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Pavel
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Posted : Nov 21, 2003 07:40
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On 2003-11-21 02:10, FluoSamsara wrote:
Yeah, I think harware can just give the power that vsts cant...I use a nord L 2, and although I write a LOT of stuff with vsts in the end I always end up recording them with the nord!
Plus, with a hardware its the hardware doing the sound processing, not the cpu...so you save loads of precious memory...
Also fx, well, those ones like compressors and other dynamic tools, vsts are simply not up for such a good job as the hardware...yet...
And also...its just sooo much fun to twist the knobs with your hands instead of with the mouse!
But yes, some softs have the power to make amazing sounds, e.g I think reaktor is just amazing, but it takes so much memory!
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Yes it's all true, but when you hit the roof in NL2 you can't do (almost) nothing to expand it.
With software like Reaktor there is no roof, the modularity and the versatility of this tool is amazing, and if you lack of computing you can easily add more memory. Show me Synth where you can do something like this as easy as in PC. I think that the thing that still beats the software in HW synths are the hands-on approach, but you are wrong if you think that it's going to last forever.
Soon you will be able to wear a helmet with eletronic gloves and you'll be able to tweak any parameter in VSTs with your own hands. Or you can use knob controller, like i do.
Well almost
solipt1c--> it won't help emulate it all, the digital distortion sounds like crap in VST FX. I tried so many times to get the right distortion when i record a guitar with a friend... It's just a waste of time. One good GTR amp will do the job 10x times better than any VST.
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timsensient
Sensient
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Posted : Nov 21, 2003 10:56
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Nothing beats putting my hands on my knob
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VCO
Inactive User
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Posted : Nov 21, 2003 11:44
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There is, and always will be need for hardware, just because a lot of people get more inspired when they are working with a real physical synth, compressor..etc, that they can touch, and develope this special relationship with.
Soft synths are now days as expressive as hardware synths, with all these sophisticated Midi controllers.
The sound is mostly about taste.
You can't get a soft synth to sound like an analogue synth. You, can't get an analogue synth to sound like a soft synth.
There is not one plug-in that can sound like an Eventide Harmoniser/Orville/Eclipse.
To my knowledge, no hardware effects processor can do the things that OhmBoyz plugs do.
No hardware synth can get Absynths' textures.
It is possible make great music whether you are using software, or hardware only.
Using both hardware and software will give that extra edge that one cannot have working only with hardware, or only with software.
A digital waveform is nothing more than an imperfect representation of the perfect analogue one. |
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NeutroN
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Nov 21, 2003 12:46
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I think you guys are moving away from the question, which is how much hardware is really needed? and what soft today can easily replace a hardware.
IMO I think their is no need to have a hardware sampler, their are loads of great soft samplers that can do the same job e.g. halion
"Great things are only possible with outrageous requests." Thea Alexander |
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Pavel
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Posted : Nov 21, 2003 13:30
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Quote:
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On 2003-11-21 11:44, VCO wrote:
There is, and always will be need for hardware, just because a lot of people get more inspired when they are working with a real physical synth, compressor..etc, that they can touch, and develope this special relationship with.
Soft synths are now days as expressive as hardware synths, with all these sophisticated Midi controllers.
The sound is mostly about taste.
You can't get a soft synth to sound like an analogue synth. You, can't get an analogue synth to sound like a soft synth.
There is not one plug-in that can sound like an Eventide Harmoniser/Orville/Eclipse.
To my knowledge, no hardware effects processor can do the things that OhmBoyz plugs do.
No hardware synth can get Absynths' textures.
It is possible make great music whether you are using software, or hardware only.
Using both hardware and software will give that extra edge that one cannot have working only with hardware, or only with software.
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Indeed, couldn't say it better.
Neutron--> i don't know exactly what your needs are but i have right now is: One PC (AMD1800+512Mb Ram), One Audiophile 2496 Sound Card, Oxygen8 MIDI Controller and paln to buy soon Nearfiled monitors and one VA Module (Probably Nord Rack or Virus Rack). I think it's the basic setup, the one thing that i constantly lack is time. Because to afford this toys i need to work a lot.
Good luck
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Kitnam
Mantik
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Posted : Nov 21, 2003 13:43
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it depends on your style of work and processflow.
the fattest studio is no garantee for a hit-track, but the smallest equitment (labtop with reason for example) is sometimes all you need to produce the best song. i have seen lots of people buying expensive analog equitment but they have no realy idea how to use them succesfully. important is the arrangement, your idea and the feeling you have.. you dont need analog compressors, you only the right ideas. after getting this with digital equitment you can go and buy the fat analog dream-maschines. otherwise its like starting to be a racedriver in the formula 1 with bike-experiences.
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