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How to get over cheese?
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Medea
Aedem/Medea
Started Topics :
127
Posts :
1132
Posted : May 3, 2011 15:19
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aciduss
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
112
Posts :
1490
Posted : May 3, 2011 16:50
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Thanks fellows... lot to think.
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jekvan
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
70
Posts :
406
Posted : May 3, 2011 17:13
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As a matter of fact,if we allready onthe subject,I was on some big festivus here in Israel (doof),and couldn't help to notice not only standartisation and "clubisation" of the sound (I'm talking about psytrance,progressive is awesome in my eyes,probably because less folks do it).
Not only that,but the shit was anti-trance:every couple of bars the dj was doing this annoying flanger sweep,stoping the tune and droping to bassline again.Fuck,this was annoying,and this is the stuff people do in clubs.
The mixing on PA was so way up that my favorite parts-pads and tiny melodic sounds were gone.Only kick and bass in distorted form,plus the hideous leads jut ripping on and on new holes in my scull.Another thing people like in clubs.
It seems that we are deluding ourself with the audience that keeps listening for psychadelics,good chunk of them are kids with serious drugs issue (they really do not take them to open up their contiousness and be a better persons),and they will dance in parties to all kind of souleless shit that carries the name psytrance.The oldies just keep coming,well,because...They hope there is still chance in listening exciting stuff.
 From all the things I lost,that sandwitch cost me most :)
http://soundcloud.com/jekvan |
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Padmapani
Started Topics :
2
Posts :
431
Posted : May 3, 2011 22:02
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^
found at ozora festival last year (and passers-by would unanimously say things like "haha, so true").
if that is no sign that it's time to try something new and NOT to comform to the cliché then i don't know what is.
while comforming to the standards will raise your chances of getting released on a "major" trance label now, i can almost guarantee you that most people will find your music boring and out-dated in 5 years from now, but if you are creative and try your own thing you could set the standards for the psytrance of the future  |
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aciduss
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
112
Posts :
1490
Posted : May 3, 2011 22:31
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This seems like a really crucial moment in my music making life. It's the evolve or die day, I just can't be mediocre or lazy, I'm not.
I also do other forms of art so in a way I do have a wide perspective on what 'style' means. It is always a very important part of the creative process to begin listening to the real you (me in my case).
What resonates with me... but at the same time psychedelic trance has been growing on a base of repetitive basslines, acidic sounds and particular timbres, the real challenge here is to take this structures and paradigms into next level and just try to build new ones even if we use the previous sounds to resemble or keep the classic psytrance flavor.
I saw a thread on other forum where it was discussed the 303 sound and someone compared it to the electric guitar... it is just a sound, an instrument and still great riffs and melodies are to be created for both of them, creativity is not determined by the sounds themselves but by the way we make them work for us.
It is the actual building of sonic scenery and intense trance substance that remains as the object to evolve; bricks and wood had been used to build houses for many years yet new shapes and trends are developed everyday. Also all other forms of art mostly depend on the same materials, colors, textures, sounds, etc. that had been here forever (some exceptions) and still they evolve in the way they are crafted, presented and perceived by the world.
The problem with recipe sounding music is the same in many genres... kbbb psy, rushy techno, dirty elektro, etc... they stick to a couple of sounds to give the entire genre / label its signature sound.
With no experienced listeners this is no problem as they can't really identify the sounds they just think it sounds killer, or dirty or groovy... but as one gets deeper into the electronic scenes there is this need to know how to get over this cliché sounds that everybody is using and then again the choosing a road: to create easy to digest commercial music similar to everything out there or try to come with a particularly new idea not necessarily made of new sounds but fresh enough and genuine, made from personal thoughts and emotions rather than popular proved techniques.
These are some of my conclusions so far... i love music and i love psytrance and i want to do it right, this along with my personal growth has taken me to this point which I thank. I will get to work trying to follow my own muse, even if I come back to classic sounds I'll try to give them the respect they deserve instead of abusing them as it has been done to death with stuff like sidechain, squelches, fm leads, goldrays and all of the psy sonic palette sounds most of you surely know.
Boom! |
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psyraal
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
77
Posts :
768
Posted : May 3, 2011 23:26
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Quote:
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I also do other forms of art so in a way I do have a wide perspective on what 'style' means. It is always a very important part of the creative process to begin listening to the real you (me in my case).
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With you there. Every single day i feel the need of listening to sounds and rythms that are out of the human kind knowledge range, i mean, we all need fresh thoughts in our minds from time to time; That's why the 'experts' call it putting together a creative process that can stimulate our minds in such a way that makes us create new stuff and come up with new ideias no matter what form of art we're into.
To make new we have to think new, see new, hear new and feel new - This, in my opinion of course.
https://soundcloud.com/neervos |
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orgytime
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
120
Posts :
1703
Posted : May 4, 2011 00:36
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hmm for this signature sound thing there would be only on thing for me relating to psy leads... keep them liquid, otherwise we have rave music LOL
i try to not use such sounds, or i change em in a way i like it (reinventing). "psy" has such a load of possibilities, thats why i love it, you can use nearly everything and shape it in a "psychedelic" way.
fart in your mic, reverb/pitch/trance gate/distort etc... it and you nearly can make a whole new track out of your fart. if your sick of the kbbb do other things, there are enough sub genres...
if you would post some tracks, maybe i could be more emphatic and understand it better.
i feel like you need to produce a "real good track" and get nice feedback to know its all good (im just talking out of my experience, so no offence mate).
cheers
www.soundcloud.com/orgytime |
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Obelizk
Amoeba
Started Topics :
115
Posts :
836
Posted : May 4, 2011 01:02
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i haven't read everything here.
It's not an easy question to make a straightforward answer to either.
I think you should just make what you think sounds good, take things you like from different genres and put it into psy.
I was thinking about the other day, if you make a song and it's danceable, it doesn't matter what you're doing with the music - if that's the aim you're going for.
Different styles of music have different styles of chords. I put some jazz solos over some parts of my psy songs, and it's fun. The beat is still there, it changes the feel of a section or two (not cheesy jazz haha).
If there are things you like from other genres, incorporate those in your music. I started really liking dubstep sounds, even though I'm not huge into dubstep, so i'm putting some of those wobbly sounds in some of my songs now. It's been hard to make them fit, but if people can dance to a weird break, then get back into the groove, it's a success.
Listen to some music that is far out there. You probably already do. But take what you know of those different styles and apply them to your songs. Learn some 'exotic' scales and write solo parts in them. I love the melodic / harmonic minors and gypsy scale.
I think overall it's about getting into grooves and feeling it all, and being able to transmute that through your hands onto a keyboard, or just have a very vivid idea of what you'd like to put down in a song.
Listening to skrillex,(again not a huge dub fan, or whatever he does) led to a semi-realization that my music doesn't have to be simple or complex in certain areas. Especially with electronic music, there are infinite possibilities to put down crazy ideas and catchy riffs that don't even make sense until you 'make them fit' in some weird way.
ramble ramble, i just had a ton of caffeine 
www.musicproductionnatural.com || www.facebook.com/djamoeba | facebook page |
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Upavas
Upavas
Started Topics :
150
Posts :
3315
Posted : May 4, 2011 01:38
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That is a problem only when you put a label
(psy, not record label)
on your sound.
Forget all about labelling your sound into genres, just do YOUR thing, and when you are convinced it sounds nice, get it released.
My experience from my dj days tells me that the music I liked most brought out the best vibes on the dancefloor, making your own music is just the same. When you really like it, chances are that other people will too.
Upavas - Here And Now (Sangoma Rec.) new EP out Oct.29th, get it here:
http://timecode.bandcamp.com
http://upavas.com
http://soundcloud.com/upavas-1/ |
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loki
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
49
Posts :
429
Posted : May 4, 2011 01:45
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HOW DID I MISS THIS THREAD!!!???!
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Stop listening to psytrance and only produce what makes you move
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This says it all, as does Colin's point "you can get away with anything if you do it with conviction."
Aciduss, i had the EXACT same set of thoughts about a year ago. Word for word, i would say to my friends, "I want to make music that no one has ever heard before, but how do I do that within psytrance?"
I started getting into more prog for that reason - even psy tech and that sort of thing - because it seemed like the new, creative, unique thing. That, of course, isn't true - there are already all sorts of conventions in psy-prog and all that jazz.
I made a couple major turns in my music making after hitting up a couple of indoor psy parties with alternative rooms that were just BANGIN' good. for the most part, they were playing fat glitch-hop and dark, tribal like dubstep. and the dancefloors had 20 times the energy and vibe of Azax or whatever cheese was playing in the other room.
So I started thinking: WTF do I want to make? I love dancing more than anything in the world - about as much as sex, beer, weed and good food... so I want to make music for the dancefloor. Music that makes people want to dance, that puts that kind of fresh, exotic, absolutely bangin' vibe into a dancefloor. Good psytrance can still do that! Fuck, oldschool "cheesy" Goa trance can totally rock a dancefloor!
But... I have a chance to make whatever I want. I still "think" of myself as a psytrance producer, which is why I post all my more recent dubsteppy/psybreaks/idunno-wtf-genre-it-is stuff on here. This is the music that makes me want to dance - in Colin OOOD's wise words, it's MY trance. And that's all I wanted to make in the first place - it only took me some number of years to figure out that I just had to fucking DO it.
ramble ramble, I work at a coffee shop so I also had a SHITLOAD of caffeine, but I feel pretty strongly about this. THIS is the kind of thread we should have on here every fucking day.
I think what keeps this "psy" is original sound design, it's creativity, it's sculpting sounds that make people say, 'what is that?!' and 'whoa, the music is doing what!?' It's music created for a trip, for that psychedelic trance dance experience that is also very much a headfuck, whether involving certain chemical 'aids' or not. It doesn't have to have a KBBB or a searing 303 acid line in my opinion... but hey, if it does, and it rocks a dancefloor, that's still fucking killer.
Peace.
Dance, even if you have nowhere to do it but your living room. ~Kurt Vonnegut
www.soundcloud.com/mixyott |
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aciduss
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
112
Posts :
1490
Posted : May 4, 2011 05:40
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Gratitude my brothers. Enlightening.
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Thx-1138
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
11
Posts :
48
Posted : May 4, 2011 05:52
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Aciduss, I've been struggling as well. Evolve or die is on my head everyday. I have 3 good tracks, and really good tracks which I cannot evolvo, I get stuck in like 1:00 and I just can't continue.
Maybe its time to listen better. |
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aciduss
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
112
Posts :
1490
Posted : May 4, 2011 07:44
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Oh you can
Squeeze that noodle in your head.
Nu psytrance ! |
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Thx-1138
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
11
Posts :
48
Posted : May 4, 2011 09:49
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Thanks yeah I didn't have to try so hard, it was just a matter of checking things again, I am making it difficult for myself.
Thanks. |
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e-scape
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
17
Posts :
351
Posted : May 8, 2011 12:37
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while comforming to the standards will raise your chances of getting released on a "major" trance label now, i can almost guarantee you that most people will find your music boring and out-dated in 5 years from now, but if you are creative and try your own thing you could set the standards for the psytrance of the future
So true... |
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