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how often do you bounce tracks?
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Obelizk
Amoeba
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115
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836
Posted : Dec 7, 2009 03:02:33
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What do you guys think is the best way workflow wise to bounce, edit, add effects and all of that?
I usually just have midi all the way through with all the effects I want to use on them, unless I have drum samples or FX pieces, then I'll bounce those from synths and apply effects separately.
Also, I know a lot of people like to use low shelf's on most of their tracks, does anyone just put that highpass eq as an effects send and then just apply it to most of the tracks?
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Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Dec 7, 2009 03:11
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First of all i dont think you can put a Highpass EQ as an effects send, it has no wet or dry mix, so it will increase the signals volume.
Send is mostly used for "time effects" like Reverb, delay, chorus and flanger, also phasers...
"Dynamic effects" such as Compressors and EQ are insert effects...
I think its always best to bounch, as fast as possible when you are satisfied, for various reasons...
But of course if there is no problem with Cpu power or memory you can keep it open for how long you want and even finish it that way, but then comes the problem of reinstall, or someone want to do a remix.. than audio is superior.. also audio opens up for a new field of edit, fade outs and fade ins, smart arrangements, audio manipulation... well things you just cant do with vst and midi... But with audio there also comes tricky parts as looping, crossover points... audio editing is a art of its own, some people are real good at it...
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Zoopy
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
44
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538
Posted : Dec 7, 2009 04:44
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I bounce everytime I create something that I really like...too many times have I come back to a project and my fucking vst has reset it's preset or done something totally retarded.. forces me to move on with the project also..aaand audio is easier to work with . and CPU , I max out my CPU ALL THE TIME. :/ |
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Koozer Mox
Koozer Mox
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52
Posts :
713
Posted : Dec 7, 2009 06:01
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hehe same here, i have 2 gb of ram and the CPU usage is high very fast forcing to bounce pretty much everything.
these days with this 2gb ram i have to have another project wich i can call "help/or support project" where i synthesize new stuff..so i bounce them and use in the original project working with the wavs..cuz if i dont use this "help/support project" i could barely hear what i am doing (still doing this i can hear this freacking annoying "squeaking crackin crickets stuff like distortions when the track is already half-made
cheers!
Greetings Earthlings!
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TimeTraveller
IsraTrance Full Member
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80
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Posted : Dec 7, 2009 06:36
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I bounce as soon as possible too because of cpu and my low ram which is only 2 gb too.
Even wondering if I should bounce audios again 'cause mostly I have besides offline processing that many inserts (atleast additional eq, mostly comp,and some effects everywhere) that cpu is almost overweighed.
Have a project with only audio files and nevertheless my cpu is almost striking because of so many inserts.
And it is not more than twenty-something tracks.
[Have also an unfinished project where twenty tracks are ready and cpu is almost empty.]
I'm using sends & groups too but inserts are often the main problem for having a cool cpu when I make psytrance .
Virtual synthesizers are to be taken away asap here.
Even freezing is not really a solution somehow.
Maybe more ram or rebouncing should be the way to get more out of it.
I'm also a bit unsure how to bounce files that are sidechained crossed,but I think a few plug ins unbounced should be ok.
I use additional projects for working wit an almost sleeping cpu too - then transport the finished wav's to the main project and have also a freezed folder sometimes for some synths or only midi files/notes.
https://soundcloud.com/shivagarden |
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Pagan
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
98
Posted : Dec 7, 2009 07:35
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I have to do the same hey, most of the time my CPU is hitting the limit before i even start doing the heavy things(like automations).
Its usually just the combination of VTS's thats doing it.
So I got into 2 distinct habits.
1: I never really use FX until i'm ready for that stage. ie: I lay out pretty much the entire track dry, with just an idea in my head of what i'm going to do when its time.
2: I run two versions of fruity at the same time, one handling the VST side of things, and then the other working with just the stems. Its on the stems version that I do all the FX and automations usually.
I need more RAM  |
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soulfood
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
10
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875
Posted : Dec 7, 2009 08:11
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I just think working in audio is far superior so I bounce as soon as I create.
I have stuff straight to audio before adding any effects, then once effects are added I make another copy of that sound so I end up with around 3-4 copies of the same sound at different stages. |
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GyPsynate
GyPsy
Started Topics :
29
Posts :
687
Posted : Dec 7, 2009 19:15
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Quote:
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On 2009-12-07 08:11, soulfood wrote:
I just think working in audio is far superior so I bounce as soon as I create.
I have stuff straight to audio before adding any effects, then once effects are added I make another copy of that sound so I end up with around 3-4 copies of the same sound at different stages.
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+1
the only thing I dont bounce is my kick ,bass, high hats. everything els is bounced lots.
I also save differnt sages of my Cubase file to be able to go back to the original tools for the sound if I need to go back and fix something.
Its nice to have dry copies of everything to use in other tracks and for possible remix packs.
Thats how you get those extremely eddited sounds- effect bounce effect bounce effect bounce and so on...
There are lots you caint do all together as 1 edit.
\\\"Invoking the inner dancing buddha with future frequencies from beyond\\\" ~GyPsy
D-A-R-K Rec, Anomalistic Rec.
Cerebral Theater
http://www.molecular.cc/GyPsy/ |
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Nectarios
Martian Arts
Started Topics :
187
Posts :
5292
Posted : Dec 7, 2009 19:40
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I used to bounce stuff a lot more in the past, especially when I wsa using analog synths, where a couple had no patch memory, but I find my self doing it less and less lately. Reason being, automating/tweaking filter cut-off and changing notes to fit a new pattern that makes more sense in the music and/or the mix, means that I have to use all my synth parts, in real time.
Its an integral part of the whole mixdown process, being able to change stuff that necessitates keeping as many synth channels, in real time as possible.
Working in audio helps you get on with making decisions and finishing tracks, but I am teaching my self to be more analytical about my arrangements and working with things in real time is a lot more forgiving and flexible.
There have been lots of times where I went back to completely erase synth parts, change the synth patch, or decide to change the scale of the bassline in certain parts, thus having to change the midi files of the synth parts. Something that is massively backtracking when you have to re-create the synth patch on an analog modular with no memory ( + it will never sound exactly the same).
I mainly bounce to create FX parts, reverse stuff, add reverse reverbs/delays.
Using a quad MacPro (1gig of RAM) to make tunes and I have no problems with CPU, as long as I keep things tidy in the arrangement.
http://soundcloud.com/martianarts |
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willsanquil
IsraTrance Full Member
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93
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2822
Posted : Dec 7, 2009 21:25
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I have heard a couple of people post something about the bouncing to audio being required for kicks, or other parts because the midi doesn't keep itself the same each time? like its not stable?
I'm using Live 8 and I have not been able to hear this as a problem with anything I've created yet...and with 4 gigs of RAM and a 2+ ghz dual-core I have not seen a single bit of lag or CPU maxing (though I've only gone up to 25 or so tracks as I'm still learning music and synthesis)..
of course audio bouncing is great if you want to reverse shit like hooligan said, and there are techniques specific to dealing with the raw wave form....
but should I be bouncing more? I don't have great speakers (working either on a $100 logitech 5.1 computer speaker setup, or with a 2.1 bose setup) so could it be possible that were I to have some quality monitors I would be able to detect these 'alterations' or 'instability' in MIDI?
Forgive me if these questions are too generalized  |
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Nectarios
Martian Arts
Started Topics :
187
Posts :
5292
Posted : Dec 7, 2009 21:30
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aciduss
IsraTrance Full Member
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112
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1490
Posted : Dec 7, 2009 22:33
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Mac fags! JK!!! XD
very nice replies in this topic... i bounce a lot to avoid rethinking my midi and synth settings... because if i don't i just keep changing them. But some stuff i do not bounce until im ok with it.
I think in terms of studio sessions... like recording players then i dont erase the midi but use the X tool in cubase to disable it. So if i ever need to bounce another take i still have midi.
Anyway, I regularly find myself in this situation where i don't know if should bounce or not. Most of the time i do it because of CPU and workflow with wavs (easier to edit like folks have already commented).
But automation can make this choice a hard one sometimes you need to tweak that specially when that part hasn't been completed.
tricky. |
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GyPsynate
GyPsy
Started Topics :
29
Posts :
687
Posted : Dec 7, 2009 23:13
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Quote:
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Using a quad MacPro (1gig of RAM) to make tunes and I have no problems with CPU, as long as I keep things tidy in the arrangement.
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1 gig? wow...
give it up to the Quad core.
\\\"Invoking the inner dancing buddha with future frequencies from beyond\\\" ~GyPsy
D-A-R-K Rec, Anomalistic Rec.
Cerebral Theater
http://www.molecular.cc/GyPsy/ |
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Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
60
Posts :
3709
Posted : Dec 8, 2009 00:11
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Quote:
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On 2009-12-07 22:33, aciduss wrote:
But automation can make this choice a hard one sometimes you need to tweak that specially when that part hasn't been completed.
tricky.
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yes sometimes very tricky =)
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Obelizk
Amoeba
Started Topics :
115
Posts :
836
Posted : Dec 8, 2009 01:12
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Yeah I feel because I don't bounce a lot of my stuff out, I'm losing out on the possibility of having lots of cool edits, but I make a lot of changes to lead parts and pads during every song, so I wouldn't be able to do that if I bounced everything out. Nobody just bounces all the tracks out at the end, then adds effects and edits? or should the question be, if you had enough RAM, would you wait til a song is pretty much finished to bounce everything and apply effects/edits?
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