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high end gear
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assaf
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
66
Posts :
242
Posted : Apr 21, 2008 04:26:55
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want to hear your opinion. anyone here is working with high end dynamic processors such as neve, ssl, manley, chandler etc?
do you think they are important in electronic music? i talked with a really big name in the trance scene and he told me he uses lots of high end/vintage gear, and it made me think if maybe its one of the pro's secrets  . or maybe we should leave it to the mastering part? i know tim schuldt uses really expensive compressors in their mastering studio ...
what you think?
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C3PO
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
29
Posts :
510
Posted : Apr 21, 2008 04:47
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Glitch_CapeTown
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
36
Posts :
952
Posted : Apr 21, 2008 09:36
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TuK
TuK
Started Topics :
41
Posts :
228
Posted : Apr 21, 2008 10:21
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for mastering yes
for producing no but you need a good mixing envirment |
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Alex Roudos
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
33
Posts :
411
Posted : Apr 21, 2008 11:49
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The only high end gear that is truly important these days imho, is monitors, ad/da converters, mics and mic pres.
If someone really knows how to mix and master ITB with the best plugs available like UAD and SSL Duende, i hardly believe that anyone could really tell the difference between an ITB and OTB mix and/or master.
 A friend told me once that the biggest mistake we make is that we believe we live, when in reality we are sleeping in the waiting room of life. |
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shachar
Basic
Started Topics :
13
Posts :
402
Posted : Apr 21, 2008 12:04
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every link in the process is important!
the highest quality your gear is (and VSt you use) the better the result in the end.
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Glitch_CapeTown
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
36
Posts :
952
Posted : Apr 21, 2008 12:33
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heretical
Started Topics :
1
Posts :
77
Posted : Apr 21, 2008 19:18
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if you had a loaded analog modular, going into a full kyma system, going into an eventide, going into an analog desk with vintage analog compression..and knew how to use all them, it would be impossible to get those sound on a PC with vst.
alot better things to drop $50k on though than that. |
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Alex Roudos
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
33
Posts :
411
Posted : Apr 21, 2008 19:49
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On 2008-04-21 19:18, heretical wrote:
if you had a loaded analog modular, going into a full kyma system, going into an eventide, going into an analog desk with vintage analog compression..and knew how to use all them, it would be impossible to get those sound on a PC with vst.
alot better things to drop $50k on though than that.
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I agree, but would that make make the sound/mix/master better? That's the never ending debate about high end analog hardware vs software.
From what i read from pro people(producers, mixing and mastering engineers) who have a great knowledge and experience from both worlds, they tend finally to come to the same conclusion. None is better, they are just different.
I was always thinking about getting the highest end analog mastering chain(comp, eq, limiter) which would be on the 25-30K euros range, because i'm an audio perfectionist.
But after reading and researching and trying for myself with the limited soft tools i have, i came to the conclusion of my post earlier.
I also want to add the 3 reasons why i believe it's not necessary to spend such a fortune.
1) Even having the best analog comps,eqs and limiters still the sound will be restricted to the (exceptionally perfect) color of these certain pieces of hardware. What if some other or no color is needed/preferred/demanded?
2) The majority of today's music ends up on iPods and/or computer speakers.
3) The last couple of years, major record labels like Warner and the like, started asking/demanding ITB mixes mainly(and masters) for their releases. The reason for that is, if something is wrong or they don't like something it can be changed very easily and immediately. They want to save time and money of course, because they know that it's impossible to recall exactly anything or everything on analog hardware, and that would result in a new all over mixing session which would probably end up sounding different and being in danger of getting on a shorter or longer vicious circle.
A friend told me once that the biggest mistake we make is that we believe we live, when in reality we are sleeping in the waiting room of life. |
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Ghost Host
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
27
Posts :
512
Posted : Apr 23, 2008 14:38
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It's very simple --> u got what u pay for! 100 euro vst to compare to 3k outboard peace it's just not comparable at all, plz don't tell me that they r all good, but just different---> NO THEY NOT! <--end! Any vst have tendency to flatten the sound, which analog processors do not, and yes they color the sound, but isn't that what we are all after?
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makus
Overdream
Started Topics :
82
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3087
Posted : Apr 23, 2008 15:22
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^^ i tend to think so also. it gives me the feeling of something i still don't know that will expose somewhere in future and surprise me to the bones.
www.overdreamstudio.com |
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subconsciousmind
SCM
Started Topics :
37
Posts :
1033
Posted : Apr 23, 2008 16:04
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I have a Crane Song STC-8 compressor. Its considered pretty high quality.
My personal experience... it can do really amazing stuff, but I'll sell it.
Why?
Because in the last year my personal progress in production technique has considerably improved my soundquality. Compared to that the STC-8 superior quality over some URS, Voxengo or UAD plugins has given me only very little gain.
What I want to say. the steps I personally can do in improving my technique are still very big, whereas the improvement I can reach through using HiEnd equipment instead of very good equipment is very small.
Once I reach the top with my production technique (which may be never) I will probably reach out for HighEnd again.
At this time the compressor was really really really great for mastering... but i found somebody who has even greater equipment in his studio which does the mastering for me... so why should i keept the HiEnd.
Was a good experience for me to have it though.
At the time you realize somebody has better production, but uses the same or worse equipment you know, that equipment will not help you. In psytrance a LOT of the best production used the same plugins we ALL use! Most of my music for you to download at:
http://www.subconsciousmind.ch |
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Alex Roudos
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
33
Posts :
411
Posted : Apr 23, 2008 18:56
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Quote:
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On 2008-04-23 14:38, wi']['ch wrote:
It's very simple --> u got what u pay for! 100 euro vst to compare to 3k outboard peace it's just not comparable at all, plz don't tell me that they r all good, but just different---> NO THEY NOT! <--end!
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No one said anything like that, you did
The only thing that was mentioned was about high end dsp solutions vs high end analog gear. And i believe that "high end?" dsp plugs like UAD, SSL Duende and maybe the new Waves API & V Series are really that good and the result will be just different, only if you know how to use them and all the other factors needed are met as well.
And i can tell you that there is at least one comp plug that you could get even for 100 euros and would kill a lot of high end analog comps because it sounds almost exactly like the real which cost around 5k. Which one is it?
The UAD Neve 33609.
A friend told me once that the biggest mistake we make is that we believe we live, when in reality we are sleeping in the waiting room of life. |
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
162
Posts :
8087
Posted : Apr 23, 2008 19:50
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it all depends about your taste... imo itb is good only if you are aiming for a clean ,crystal clear sound. if you want some vibes ,some depth, some warm then forget itb mix ,analog is the way to go but not analog transparent sounding gears ,very colored ones,there is no magic hapening in plugins . |
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Mike A
Subra
Started Topics :
185
Posts :
3954
Posted : Apr 23, 2008 21:24
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Quote:
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On 2008-04-23 16:04, subconsciousmind wrote:
What I want to say. the steps I personally can do in improving my technique are still very big, whereas the improvement I can reach through using HiEnd equipment instead of very good equipment is very small.
Once I reach the top with my production technique (which may be never) I will probably reach out for HighEnd again.
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This is one of the more wise and correct things I've read in this forum ever. WTG
This quote should appear is every place someone is asking about buying hardware 
Quote:
| it all depends about your taste... imo itb is good only if you are aiming for a clean ,crystal clear sound. if you want some vibes ,some depth, some warm then forget itb mix ,analog is the way to go but not analog transparent sounding gears ,very colored ones,there is no magic hapening in plugins . |
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