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Give something back to the artists or not?
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Kras
Started Topics :
7
Posts :
84
Posted : Jun 13, 2011 22:11
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If you want them to pay, make it easy
Everything changes very fast. Technology of communication has advanced way further then economic models. For me, it's cumbersome to donate or buy online. I remember few attempts when cash service providers said that either my country is not on the list or my card is invalid or whatever. If it would be one-click away with secure transfer then for sure more people would donate. I'm quite an impulsive person and few times I've just opened up some sites and bought stuff. I've bought some CDs that way although I'm not that kind of person that buys music. Especially now, when most of my CDs has already wore off and tracks - one by one - stop to be playable. It pisses me off because now I'm forced to illegally download CDs that I own.
Banks - the issue of ideology
The other thing is that going to a bank or using their services is highly repulsive to my mind. Maybe most of you don't get it but people not always like to deal with banks, some had very bad experiences, others see them as parasites. Many people in this scene (at least in Europe) are either fierce anti-capitalists or they just dislike it by intuition. Paying by the net = paying by the bank. I'm not willing to discuss the idea of capitalism - it's irrelevant. The main thing is that some people just don't like banks.
Festival Markets
The best way to change that is to sell music on festivals. Selling music on a festival should be far more important then cloths or drugs. You could spend all your cash on plenty of psychedelics but it was hard to find a stall with music that you enjoy. Because I'm not enjoying lots of albums and because the covers are so misleading, I rarely would buy an album without listening to it first.
No illegal downloads means smaller audience
The main technical reason why I'm posting here is the fact that I've downloaded some psytrance years ago. If someone would borrow me a CD or two I doubt that I would be listening to this music today. I was constantly exposed to psytrance on lots of Internet sources until something caught my attention. Now I play on small parties and I'm way under the line. Maintenance of my equipments and making decos is way more expensive then few euros that I earn on parties. I'm exposing new people to this music, I was on many parties, some big, some small and I've made my contribution. When it comes to buying your work on CDs on digital - I rather make my own art.
Drop your negative emotions
Just don't hate me, I earn around 700 euros, I spend almost half of this on bills and I try to make art from what is left. Guess what, not much is left and sometimes I need to pass on a breakfast to make my ends. |
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Alfie Sunshine
Started Topics :
0
Posts :
24
Posted : Jun 13, 2011 22:17
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On 2011-06-13 18:26:07, Beat Agency wrote:
I have been wondering what motivate so many people to not give anything back to the artists who's music they seem to enjoy so much.
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That first sentence is so contradictory Kristian.
Most people have heard it all before - so we just listen to the cheap stuff for free, get bored of it within 24 hrs and find something else to listen to / or download
It's not just this genre and all its silly sub-genres, it's all across the board for dance music.
The internet has changed the music industry and left it flat on it's back now. It's 2011, not 1980
I do feel for you, having nice music you made and not getting anything back - sucks to be you if you feel angry about it
And +1 to what Kras said ^ Many of my friends sell LOTS of CD's at festivals - ones they burned themselves, for 5 euros a pop |
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Beat Agency
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
53
Posts :
1752
Posted : Jun 13, 2011 22:23
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On 2011-06-13 22:17, Alfie Sunshine wrote:
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On 2011-06-13 18:26:07, Beat Agency wrote:
I have been wondering what motivate so many people to not give anything back to the artists who's music they seem to enjoy so much.
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That first sentence is so contradictory Kristian.
Most people have heard it all before - so we just listen to the cheap stuff for free, get bored of it within 24 hrs and find something else to listen to / or download
It's not just this genre and all its silly sub-genres, it's all across the board for dance music.
The internet has changed the music industry and left it flat on it's back now. It's 2011, not 1980
I do feel for you, having nice music you made and not getting anything back - sucks to be you if you feel angry about it
And +1 to what Kras said ^
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Why do you assume I am angry? I dont see anywhere I express any anger  I am debating and opened up a topic I have been wondering about for some time now.
Call me naive or an idealist but I still believe things can be turned around (I am not preaching that artists should get rich). It just need a collective effort and maybe a bit of "education" so people understand that artists actually suffer these days. Unless they do as me get a day job that on the other hand prevent me from making the music I like to make.
 www.beatagency.dk |
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Alfie Sunshine
Started Topics :
0
Posts :
24
Posted : Jun 13, 2011 22:27
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artists actually suffer these days
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Unfortunately, that's the way the cookie crumbles these days mate
I wasn't having a go at you, just trying to express my feelings on the matter and probably not doing it very well
Take care x |
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Beat Agency
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
53
Posts :
1752
Posted : Jun 13, 2011 22:31
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On 2011-06-13 22:27, Alfie Sunshine wrote:
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artists actually suffer these days
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Unfortunately, that's the way the cookie crumbles these days mate
I wasn't having a go at you, just trying to express my feelings on the matter and probably not doing it very well
Take care x
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No worries I was not offended
It's really a interesting debate into psychology to understand people's reasoning and actions. I mean I am sure most would be happy to pay the artists if he was in the street begging for breadcrumbs - if they recognized the artist of course 
www.beatagency.dk |
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Beat Agency
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
53
Posts :
1752
Posted : Jun 13, 2011 22:39
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Quote:
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On 2011-06-13 22:11, Kras wrote:
No illegal downloads means smaller audience
The main technical reason why I'm posting here is the fact that I've downloaded some psytrance years ago. If someone would borrow me a CD or two I doubt that I would be listening to this music today. I was constantly exposed to psytrance on lots of Internet sources until something caught my attention. Now I play on small parties and I'm way under the line. Maintenance of my equipments and making decos is way more expensive then few euros that I earn on parties. I'm exposing new people to this music, I was on many parties, some big, some small and I've made my contribution. When it comes to buying your work on CDs on digital - I rather make my own art.
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The question is not IF you would not have found artists and their music without the internet or borrowing CD's. I am sure most of us agree that the internet, borrow a CD or downloading to find out if you like the music is perfect OK. The issue is IF you pay the artists when you really like their music and listen to it over and over again? It's here the important issues is found and IMO it's here most people fail to show their lack of willingness to support the artists. Of course I am not speaking about all people but let's be honest. The majority do not really care! At least that is my interpretation of their lack of will to example donate to an artist they really like.
www.beatagency.dk |
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Alfie Sunshine
Started Topics :
0
Posts :
24
Posted : Jun 13, 2011 22:40
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yep
sometimes, the best solution is to go out the house and stop thinking too hard about a 'scene' that is well past it's sell by date |
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Beat Agency
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
53
Posts :
1752
Posted : Jun 13, 2011 22:43
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On 2011-06-13 22:40, Alfie Sunshine wrote:
yep
sometimes, the best solution is to go out the house and stop thinking too hard about a 'scene' that is well past it's sell by date
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There is some truth in that BUT if you as me live and breath for your music making (Creating music has been in my life for 30 years) and simply need to make music as other people need food then I am sure you also would wonder about things and also like to see if they could be changed. Not that little me would ever be able to change anything (Even BONO would not be able to crack this nut he he). But at least it's nice to try and understand people's motivations. Maybe then you can drive in their direction and somehow meet them on half way.
www.beatagency.dk |
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DETOX
Moderator
Started Topics :
296
Posts :
6194
Posted : Jun 13, 2011 23:46
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Quote:
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On 2011-06-13 22:11, Kras wrote:
If you want them to pay, make it easy
Everything changes very fast. Technology of communication has advanced way further then economic models. For me, it's cumbersome to donate or buy online. I remember few attempts when cash service providers said that either my country is not on the list or my card is invalid or whatever. If it would be one-click away with secure transfer then for sure more people would donate. I'm quite an impulsive person and few times I've just opened up some sites and bought stuff. I've bought some CDs that way although I'm not that kind of person that buys music. Especially now, when most of my CDs has already wore off and tracks - one by one - stop to be playable. It pisses me off because now I'm forced to illegally download CDs that I own.
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There are one thousand ways to transfer money to someone in our days from paypal and western union to electronic bank transfer or with the use of a credit card or even visiting the bank and making a direct transfer. If you WANT to transfer money to someone there are ways, if you DONT WANT to transfer money then you can come up with a thousand excuses. Oh and if you want to protect your original cds do what 90% of the people do which is making a copy and using the copy instead of the original which is also legal by the way.
Quote:
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On 2011-06-13 22:11, Kras wrote:
Banks - the issue of ideology
The other thing is that going to a bank or using their services is highly repulsive to my mind. Maybe most of you don't get it but people not always like to deal with banks, some had very bad experiences, others see them as parasites. Many people in this scene (at least in Europe) are either fierce anti-capitalists or they just dislike it by intuition. Paying by the net = paying by the bank. I'm not willing to discuss the idea of capitalism - it's irrelevant. The main thing is that some people just don't like banks.
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Good then go to the post office and send 5 euros to your favorite artists with an envelope and include a thank you message inside,i am sure he will appreciate it plus you will skip the bank problem issue. Or maybe you hate post offices too?.....
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On 2011-06-13 22:11, Kras wrote:
Festival Markets
The best way to change that is to sell music on festivals. Selling music on a festival should be far more important then cloths or drugs. You could spend all your cash on plenty of psychedelics but it was hard to find a stall with music that you enjoy. Because I'm not enjoying lots of albums and because the covers are so misleading, I rarely would buy an album without listening to it first.
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Not only people dont buy music that they havent listened before but also very very few people buy music in festivals anyway. Plus an artist is at a festival to play music not to set up a stall and sell it and stay there for 4-5 days in order to sell 15-20 cds.
Quote:
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On 2011-06-13 22:11, Kras wrote:
No illegal downloads means smaller audience
The main technical reason why I'm posting here is the fact that I've downloaded some psytrance years ago. If someone would borrow me a CD or two I doubt that I would be listening to this music today. I was constantly exposed to psytrance on lots of Internet sources until something caught my attention. Now I play on small parties and I'm way under the line. Maintenance of my equipments and making decos is way more expensive then few euros that I earn on parties. I'm exposing new people to this music, I was on many parties, some big, some small and I've made my contribution. When it comes to buying your work on CDs on digital - I rather make my own art.
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I dont know what you think or know about this issue but i know that ten years ago labels used to sell 4-5 thousand copies and the big artists were selling even more and the big festivals and events had more people than they are having now so i dont know what bigger audience you are talking about,except ofcourse if the ordinary guy that has an Infected Mushroom in his youtube favorites list or a Skazi or Astrix track is suddenly considered part of the psy trance audience....
Quote:
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On 2011-06-13 22:11, Kras wrote:
Drop your negative emotions
Just don't hate me, I earn around 700 euros, I spend almost half of this on bills and I try to make art from what is left. Guess what, not much is left and sometimes I need to pass on a breakfast to make my ends.
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Not having money is fair,most people dont have money BUT like i said before if you just spend 5-10 euros per month for your music and everybody followed your example then this scene would be working great. Unfortunately most people dont even spend 10 euros A YEAR for the music they love....
Toodaloo Motherfuckers!!!!! |
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supergroover
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
39
Posts :
1505
Posted : Jun 13, 2011 23:47
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I think the 'free or pay' button on ektoplazm is a great idea! Then you are reminded every time you download something that you can donate. Would be great if that worked.
soundcloud.com/supergroover |
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Alfie Sunshine
Started Topics :
0
Posts :
24
Posted : Jun 13, 2011 23:52
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It does work supergroover mate - I've donated over 100 euros in the last year alone to tunes I like and downloaded from there. Maybe not everyone else is so generous. |
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Basilisk
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
168
Posts :
2984
Posted : Jun 14, 2011 02:39
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There is considerable room for improvement here. I hope to be able to do something about it in the future.
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saintcarl
Started Topics :
2
Posts :
209
Posted : Jun 14, 2011 02:57
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Sounds like an alternative way to make money is required. Some kind of sponsors? Advertising would not work unless increased traffic. Something "extra" for paying?
Subscription based psy would be cool. $5 a month for all psy releases would be worth it.
Sorry, most of this music is too disposable now to be worth so much. |
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
162
Posts :
8087
Posted : Jun 14, 2011 03:07
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what i m wondering and maybe beat agency could enlight me on this one is why everything went wrong...cause the music is available for free since decades,that's what radio is. |
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DETOX
Moderator
Started Topics :
296
Posts :
6194
Posted : Jun 14, 2011 03:09
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PoM there was no psychedelic radio before ten years,psy trance stations are an internet trend.Plus most tracks have advertisments within them and are broadcasted on a very low quality. Toodaloo Motherfuckers!!!!! |
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