golem
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Posted : Apr 23, 2014 05:25:15
I have a bit of problems in my basslines. Sometimes I use gallop bassline (2 notes), sometimes fullon (3 notes).
The main problem is that when I use the fullon bassline, it sounds better in both of my monitors and headphones but very blurry/mushy in a club soundsystem.
in lets say 50secs it sounds pretty good from small speakers, but not good with a club soundsystem, then in 4minutes it sounds very good in club soundsystem but a bit boring from speakers.
The problem is the note that comes immediately after kick, it seems to ruin the bassline.
I know that one common solution to deal this would be to make the tail of the kick shorter, but do you have any other suggestions?
I tought perhaps about bouncing the note right after the kick to a separate track and treat it differently (highpass), does it sound a bad idea?
I think that the tune might also be a bit out of balance (too much low frequencies in relation to mid/high). Would you repair by master equalizer or mixing the whole thing again?
I think the problem is that club soundsystems (especially subwoofers) have very bad impulse response. Maybe the subwoofer isnt just fast enough to move to a bass sound so fast after the kick and that is the reason why two note basslines sound so much better on clubs...?
http://www.soundcloud.com/dreaml4nd
Your kick and bass are muffled,they lack of mid presence and high frequencies.Dont overthink and complicate,just separate them with EQ to find nice tonal balance-do this within a mix or put some full drum loop to make it easier to hear what needs to be corrected cause other way around you may be trying to fix whats doesnt need to be fixed and thus ruining the sound.In your example you cuted mids and highs to compensate for bass power and it sounded good while kick and bass played in solo but when in the mix they sound muddy.How loud you listen while mixing is also important aspect cause on lower volume you hear less bass.Your rooms acoustic plays major role too and maybe it gives you wrong perception.Regarding the first note after kick there is no need for some special treatment ,you just need to decide who will go lower(again EQ) and then put some sidechain compression or velocity to volume/cuttof in bassline synth.Cheers
agreed about the lacking bodythingy. sweep around from 200-800hz, find the goodys, dip slightly, wide q. iŽd suggest to sidechain the bass to the kick, it can make a huge difference. putting the velocity of the first note some more down might do the trick too, anyways could change the groove. youŽll get kinda fullon bass with that galoppy feeling.....
you might give some track delay.... might be some latency issue.
you might be good with bouncing the whole bass thingy and cut accordingly.... many ways to rome.
anyways, never solve a problem on your master! aside the fact you got only eq as your main solution on your master, which steals you all your other possibilities that might sound better, you really might want to leave it free and benefit of the fact you can solve it on source....always keep your master clean, mix clean at a constant level, never let anything clip in your signal chain. you dont need anything on your master, for what reason should one?
oh and sure its not the sub not capable reproducing such "fast" movements....in fact that bud reproduces the slowest movements of the whole content, its just made for that the lower the sound, the longer the wavecycle, thus slower the movement the driver is forced to.
so never mind, if smth sounds shit...... it probably is ^^
keep in mind the acoustics of the room you listen play a huge role! a club usually isnt that good to check your sound cause of its massive reflections. if you know they pay great attention on their system and the club is well treated...ok. but usually any bathroom sounds better. ^^
in such situations i ask myself the same question you put up here, i usually save any more hassle, put all faders down and mix again with a fresh ear at another day, week, month .... sure you do that in a mirrored project file, non destructive, cause you will bite ya ass if you find that old bass been better you just not been able to hear and realize
knocz
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Posted : Apr 23, 2014 12:14
Hmm I'd say you are not leaving enough space between the notes, not allowing your speakers to go back to 0 and ultimately over-efforting the speakers (they are trying too hard )
- could you please try giving the kick and bass notes a bit less tail, assuring that there's a tiny bit of silence between each note, and try again in both your studio system and club soundsystem - Not sure this will immediately solve your issue, but it's worth a shot!
smoker
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Posted : Apr 23, 2014 16:58
try to put wave's IR1 Convolution Reverb
put on reverb time 0.3s and Dry/wet 0.318 just play with Dry/wet and see what batter for you
it will open your sound more without Destroying the dynamics off your track and it will sound good on club monitor
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jizy
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Posted : Apr 23, 2014 17:30
yeh nice tune...
bouncing the lo elements and fading tails really really pays off if u want it punchier (not to much)...
seems like extra efforts i know but it is worth it.
dont be fooled by fast 'tight' envelopes,as tails builds up as the chain progresses.. bounce it,sample it , treat it. then you got no worries and can enjoy the rest of it.
for character and tone ,id rather the mentioned speakafreakers 0 feed 0 mod phaser rotor trick than the reverb, just my opinion tho.
what knocs and jizy said: the notes seem to be overlapping and you have too much sustain on the filter envelope for my taste...i also hear distortion (?) what makes it even more muddy.
jizy
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Posted : Apr 25, 2014 00:23
nice tune tho, it isnt that noticeable anyways... something i doubt i would of noticed,if u wouldnt of sed anything, its got alot of nice shit goin on for me to think.. that dam first note of bassline is upetin the balance... nope i wouldn't of thought it... great tune, and something tells me you know this anyways......
reminds me of a whacky tune hard as fuck level on sonic the hedgehog!such good days ..1992-1994 - u deserve a follower (me luky u) lol for brining back apart of ma childhood!
and if your really that bothered and cant be arsed to fade tails, i seriously think that this is theee sidechain of sidechains... no clickyity click artifacts u get when kick is soled..its just fuking great to put it like the blunt bastard sharp object iam x
try before buy and if you like pay for it coz softubes deserve every penny of the governments fake coin!
yes it is putting strain a 'slight' on headphones (easily fixed inwhich u wil coz u can), but the importaint factis u got a foundation and unfodlin story, but man, its upto u to mix it down.im sure u more than capable ..
fukin beautiful, mate dont waste time in here complaining,thats my fault lol,must b catchin on quite a trend eh !
u got wings ... fuk the first note nuthin perfect,as much as u want it to be, it will never be.. beautiful life trys tho. there4 can never ever fail
PRO-Gram
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Posted : Apr 25, 2014 17:41
Sound of the bass is nice and warm, but you need a more punchy kick,the kick tail should end just as the bass notes start or you can sidechain the bass. But to be honest its all about eq and compression, these are the tools which the pros have mastered.
This bassline def needs some bass and low mid removing 150hz-400hz, also needs to be compressed a bit tighter, amp/filter envelope of the bassline could do with tightening too, try some gently saturation too may help.
jizy
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Posted : Apr 25, 2014 18:33
man... how much did i drink lastnight? scratchin head ,
fuk i run on sum.
frisbeehead
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Posted : Apr 28, 2014 16:22
Trick is: make sure it sounds right before any processing!
Seems to me it's mostly about the length of both Kick and Bass notes, like knocz and jizy said. Sampling the notes could help, but it's often tedious and best reserved for analogue synthesizers with free running oscillators (or if you're using note-to-note compression...); you should be able to have a perfectly controlled sound with just the instrument's envelopes.
I always say this to everyone: get yourself an oscilloscope and check the waveform in real time, make sure the notes are not overlapping and pay special attention to the interaction between Kick and first Bass note. It's also useful to see what the compressor is doing to the signal in real time, like: when you're adjusting the attack on a compressor, you get to see how it's shaping the transients, how far the peaks are from the meat, so forth and so on...
Sidechain compression helps, but it shouldn't be used entirely as "a fix", it's also about the pumping effect. In other words, Kick length matters even if you're ducking the Bass with it.
snowdogg
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Posted : Apr 29, 2014 00:04
all this feedback, wheres the OP?
jizy
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Posted : Apr 29, 2014 01:54
like i sed.. if you cant be assed to fade tails sidechain non essential... but outa all the ones tested softubes great..he'l probly end up losing the first note by using that anyways ... hey hoo tho depends on the method... all up to u really
golem
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Posted : May 6, 2014 15:02
sorry, havent been here for a while.
thanks for all the tips
here is a newly mixed version where I lowcut the first note higher and it is EQed also better (I cut a lot of low frequencies):
B-recluse
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Posted : May 6, 2014 16:26
well make sure that if you got the 3 bassline note before you , that your velocity on the first bassline has to be adjust make that if you use a vst for your bassline that you can add velocity ( filtercutoff , or volume ) sylenth got that right . so in the midi clip for your bass line the velocity respons let the kick breed . or sampel your bassline i use ableton so i only have to put in in the sampler and make the apply 50 velocity and no problems with clashing . ofcourse before you trow it ina a sampler remove the tale , fate a bit in and the end fate out a bit til you got feel its good !
the lower the sound, the longer the wavecycle, thus slower the movement the driver is forced to.
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