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Errors in the track! Help....
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goatrancejp
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
19
Posts :
26
Posted : Feb 14, 2013 21:49:11
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Hi Guys in some projects im producing after listen the sound i can find some bizzare errors....like inicial wrong nuances...some filter in the wrong place, or for exemple i change some parameter and after i forget what i´ve done and mass up the tune....a little!
what you guys do to find errors after listen an won track and how could i correct that more easily? for exemple: in one track i change some things on ozone and chenge all the tuune i had created....after thinking arround for a good time i found that the problem was great compression and wrong parameters on izotope ozone...
some one can share some tips about correting errors while producing a track?
thanxxxx
Tebrabyte
http://soundcloud.com/fractalsounds |
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goatrancejp
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
19
Posts :
26
Posted : Feb 14, 2013 21:56
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Adding a note....
some wrongs are there but we even can find where it is....the help is on this!
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frisbeehead
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
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Posts :
1352
Posted : Feb 14, 2013 23:41
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Hey,
you probably won't gain much by using something such as Ozone on the master output channel while producing: because all your decisions will be based on that post processing - and it should be the other way around.
try to inspect each element of the track isolated to see where changes need to be made. but remember: mixing is about the context, so what you're really trying to do is make things fit well together. once you're happy with something, compromise: save the presets if that's the case, or channel settings (also very useful), and leave it as is. if you're constantly introducing change to what you've done, you're stuck in the same place, and after a while, you're no longer dealing with the same sounds in a mix, so it's kind of natural things will sound off...
automation, creating different versions of sounds, so forth and so on, is good of course: but duplicate those tracks, make those changes on those, and arrange the tune so that those changes correspond to different passages in time - as it contributes to add interest to your track. If I read you right, I think it's a matter of thinking about it a little. You can probably gain from changing your work flow a little: creating and composing, adjusting the arrangement (editing and stuff), mixing after the tune is laid out, and only then should you worry about mastering - and that's when ozone comes in.
The rule of gold here is: it's all in the mix! the mix must sound good by itself, don't turn to ozone to fix mix problems, go back and tweak things to your liking. mastering is just when you're really happy with the mix - last thing on the list. Hope this helps.
Cheers |
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goatrancejp
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
19
Posts :
26
Posted : Feb 15, 2013 04:28
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Hey buddy i apreciate your advices....i think that itps gonna really helpfull to me!
so....im actually aplying the ozone to correct frequencies conflict exemple two sound conflicting under another....or maybe i wanna put some synth over another one so i aply the threshold more in one then the another....for qhat i could understand what y´ve said....i must creat all the track and aply the ozone in the last part over the master track....but im using it apart to each channel....and each synth to correct conflicts of frequencies....
i dont know if im using in the better way possible, but i like to use my ears on production to achieve some good results.
im a begginer on mix and mastering stuff, it´s sounds complicated to me but nothing more intersting then using what we can hear in the sound!
i usually cut some synths sounds under 120hz cause they can block my bassline....tell me the way you usually use ozone in your productions and if there is another ways to correct freq conflicts tell me a solution....
thankxxx for now
Terabyte |
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frisbeehead
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
10
Posts :
1352
Posted : Feb 15, 2013 19:27
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yes, you can use Ozone on tracks to. I think it's a bit demanding for the cpu, you could try alloy 2 - also by izotope.
If you have conflicts between sounds, the solution for that is always EQ and stereo placement. Izotope's EQ is quite good, just try to leave some space for each sound.
Compressors are only suited to reduce the dynamics, shaping the volume a bit - in some cases also add a touch of character to the sound (specially with analogue emulations...). If you're talking sidechain, though, then yeah, it's also suited to avoid conflicts, like the usual using kick as input for compressing the bass scenario...
What I think would be best is: no Ozone on master channel, EQ first until everything sounds good and has it's place on the mix, only then worry about dynamics and such stuff, let alone mastering... One thing at a time 
You're saying you highpass sounds at 120Hz, and that's the way to do it. but 120Hz may not be enough, depending on the bass's frequencies. Try 200Hz, or something like this. Also, try and use some stereo pan or widening for sounds that are on the same frequency region, you can also separate them a tad with careful use of reverb.
yeah, nothing fancy here. just take your time with EQ, don't clutter the same region of the spectrum much, that's also key for a clear sound. Use your stereo! Play with it!
Compressors are used to control the volume, most often to bring the highest level peaks closer to the lower ones, so the volume is more even. But can also be used to enhance the attack of a sound, or smooth it out, so forth and so on. Multi-band compression is somewhat more complicated, so if you're having trouble figuring out what to do, my advise would be to use only one band, like a regular compressor. Read about it and experiment! It's not so hard as it seems!
Also, try to use other plug-ins instead of relying just on Ozone's included modules. It's a very complete and feature rich set, but it's good to try more things so as to gain more perspective. Use stereo analysis tools! There's a great one from Voxengo that's free:
http://www.voxengo.com/product/span/
you can even display the frequencies of more then one channel at the same time, which is great to check if there's frequencies colliding, as you say... A very handy tool!
Cheers
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goatrancejp
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
19
Posts :
26
Posted : Feb 15, 2013 22:15
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Frisbree....thankxx a lot man....
today in the morning i was making some experiments with the final sounds on ozone and sometimes when i use it incorretly the sound that i´ve used it seems to be getting out of the hole track....
after some experiments i found out that the dynamics tools and other parameter of ozone diferents then ED tool must be very wise used otherwise the sound can be massed up.....
if you can sand me some material related with what y´re trying to explain me i whould be greatfull....
my email adress is ironsoldierjp@uol.com.br or ironsoldierjp@gmail.com
some texts to send me to study more the subject we are discussing right now....
about the Dynamics i´ve used to threshold the sound exemple in the bassline region freq....about the Voxengo i´ve never used that plugin and i have no ideia how to....
but ill search some videos on youtube about that stereo analysis!
see you soon....
let me hear your sounds mate!
send me the soundcloud....
cya thankxxx a lot..
Terabyte |
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frisbeehead
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
10
Posts :
1352
Posted : Feb 16, 2013 14:47
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About mixing, I recommend you read the dedicated thread here:
http://forum.isratrance.com/the-mother-of-all-mixing-techniques-thread/
It's a lot, but I'm sure there's some gems along the way, along with plenty of useful links for more detailed info.
But, in general, it's ideal to address a mix with groups: your low end, your mid range with leads and pads and stuff like that, the high end, mostly hats and cymbals and some very sharp or airy sounds and textures...
To make things fit in a mix, you really need to avoid having many sounds in the same region of the spectrum. And that's where such a tool as Span (which you can add to your master channel, btw, and it graphically displays the frequencies of the mix, or just some sounds, if you solo them, so as to give you some feedback of what's going on). So the most useful tool here, will probably be your high pass filter: making sure that the mid range sounds don't bleed into the bass instruments (usually kick and bass) much. So as to preserve clarity. Depending on the bass, it should be somewhere around 200-250Hz.
Try to focus on just this, for a while. Just try to obtain a clear sounding mix with just careful programming of your sounds, composition and subtractive EQ (like the above mentioned high pass filter).
You've mentioned the "threshold parameter" in Ozone more then once. Google "compressor basics" and read what you can about it - there's probably good info here to on that. What that means is, once the sound reaches the threshold level, compression is applied with the ratio you've selected, for example 3.1: which means that for every 3dB the sound goes beyond the threshold level, only 1dB will go beyond it. This two settings are the most important in any compressor (and some only have those two parameters), and then there's the envelope. Once the input signal reaches the threshold level, attack is the amount of time it takes for the compression to be applied, and the release is how long after that the compression holds. This two settings are also key, and it takes some experience to grasp this stuff fully... But all that happens with compressors or the "dynamics" in Ozone is just, so to speak, volume treatment, reducing the difference between low levels and high levels (that's what compression means) and this isn't the tool for separating the sounds, or getting space for them, nor to obtain clarity in a mix.
So I'd focus on EQ first. The mix should sound clear and focused with just some EQ applied to it. It may lack some punch, or presence, but those problems can be solved later on. I think it's a matter of making it simple, first. Not trying to solve everything at once. If you do use compressors, be sure to remove the extra bands. Multi-band compressors are good for many things, but there's really no need for them for general bread and butter dynamics treatment on all of your sounds: one band is enough imo.
If I find some stuff, I'll send to you. I'm rather busy these days. Cheers |
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goatrancejp
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
19
Posts :
26
Posted : Feb 18, 2013 05:31
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Great mate!!!!!!
im downloading some fabfilter EQ tutorials to watch...
thankxx a lot.... |
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Soma_Happiens
Started Topics :
9
Posts :
120
Posted : Feb 18, 2013 13:00
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If i understand your problem correctly you have an effect on a track witch you tweak to sound good on different parts of the track (time wise). and when you make it sound good at say 0.20 min then you tweak it to sound good at 1,20 min and it makes your 0.20 sound like shit again.
i have the same problem while using reason - because one can not bounce there, so first thing to do if unable to bounce is to use automation - record every parameter of your effect while on 0.20 min of the track, then if different parameters are needed later record them again, and again, if you just turn the knobs when you think is necessary and earlier parameters are not recorded, you change them for the whole song and make a mess
 In A Society That Has Abolished All Adventure The Only Adventure That Remains Is To Abolish Society
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frisbeehead
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
10
Posts :
1352
Posted : Feb 18, 2013 15:11
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this could also be the case, of course. another way to go, if one doesn't want to compromise soon, by bouncing down the tracks, is to simply duplicate them and make the needed adjustments. One thing that I recommend is: when you're adjusting the EQ of a given sound, listen to how the others sound, it can only sound good in relation to the context.
I think the last version of Reason does support audio, along with some third party machines for the Rack - which are exclusive to Reason (not standard AU/VST plug-ins) since they also allow for the usual patching on the back.
I also think it's a good idea to craft the sounds - on the synthesizers - already thinking of where they'll be placed on the mix, in terms of frequency. It's not ideal to rely much on EQ to fix things. With experience, you begin to compose in a way that encompasses what you have learned from mixing, distributing sounds across the spectrum seamlessly.
There's a range of effects that can also help while mixing: such as reverb, that adds a sense of space and/or distance, delay, that can make things sound more weightless... Next on line would be panning and stereo placement in general, which includes M/S processing, doubling tracks and pan them in opposite directions, putting a small delay in one of them for the Haas effect, so forth and so on...
To sum it up: you should find space for sounds in terms of frequency and then make proper use of the stereo field, for achieving a mix with depth and width and great overall clarity. That's the space there is to fill. And in order to do it, I recommend watching videos online, read whatever you can about it, each of the tools available, and experiment a lot.
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goatrancejp
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
19
Posts :
26
Posted : Mar 5, 2013 21:26
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Thankxxx a lot soma thats extacly what was happening with me lol.....but im practicing more and getting used with automations.....good vibes man and productions! |
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frisbeehead
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
10
Posts :
1352
Posted : Mar 6, 2013 06:19
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check your inbox, sent you a PM |
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