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East coast/West coast
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Nutz
Started Topics :
7
Posts :
50
Posted : Oct 14, 2004 08:53
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Paradigm, word up yo. It's that family feeling that makes everything so special. You make a great point.
Drug issue: Hey do what you want when you want, it's your body and nobody can tell you what to do with it. "drugs are bad... m'kay?"
Brett: I love you my BM campmate... but wow, I remember the feeling that I had found all that is perfect in the world... but after having to deal with the production side of things (yeah I pretend to be a "promoter" now and again) things are shady and not allways as beautiful as they seem.
NYC prices: I was merely making a comparison. I'm sure that there are reasons that the prices are so high, not that anyone is trying to gouge others. I remember being in the office of a club and seeing on the dry erase board this: music + booze = girls = $ = booty for (club owner) and (club owner). Believe me, I understand that getting a venue to do your thing isn't easy. The sign of a really GOOD "promoter": none of the attendees know that the sound system fell through and you had to get a backup or that the generator died, etc.
None of us are in this for money... If we were, we'd all be friggin crazy, because there is none in it. I know hundreds of promoters who have lost THOUSANDS of dollars throwing just 1 party, and they'll do it again in a heartbeat... why, you ask? For the people. Thank you guys, for putting in all of that hard work and making sure that we all have a good time. I know you guys get ragged on, but I know it's a lot of work and we appriciate it, I promise.
Personally, I'd call myself a hippy... as far back as I can remember I've been a Beatles/Hendrix/Pink Floyd kinda guy... and I'm only 25. I don't really look the part, but that's who I am. The "Good ol days" were gone well before I was born, but at least I have something now that I can connect with, and that's a beautiful thing.
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bluespectralmonkey
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
80
Posts :
1336
Posted : Oct 14, 2004 18:10
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well it comes down to this, on page 5.
surrender... you made your point. . maybe losing a little face in the process? its kinda daring to make such comments. come on down to asheville and check us out before you make judgements dude, that just makes you look silly.
everyone else seems to truly beleive in the music, the community that surrounds the love of it, and all the magic that comes of that.
why bitch about something if youre not going to do something about it? i guess people like to hear themselves bitch, i am not immune to that. identifying and networking with like minds to narrow down what exactly the issue is is crucial. making cutting comments toward one another is counterproductive.
cutting the scene down the middle just doesnt make sense tho... the east and west are connected in so many ways, and its mostly geography that separates one side from the other... theres lots of minds in between that have no clue,,, maybe its time we spread out and give support to those in the center of this giant island... i mean look at colorado, they have some killllller djs. its not just between the east and west here. and its a farce to try to make it that simple.
basically i feel like saying what i say to myself whenever the going gets tough and we have a party no-one comes to... "we just want everyone to have as much fun as we do..." but, its not for everyone, we should be happy with what we have, cause "you dont know what youve got till its gone!"
yes man, psytrance may be dead, and so is punk, and rock and roll, and skate boarding and my grandmother, but they all live on! and on and on.
kill psytrance! long live psytrance!
there are too many points to be made to try to find some sort of closure in this discussion. not sure why i am trying... i guess its selfish motivation so i can feel better about this post thats been eating away at my head all week.
yes, the east and west are different on so many levels BESIDES how the psytrance parties go. thats something we cant change. but with further intermingling between the east and west families, our scene/family can only grow stronger. we will all feel the benefits, people network ideas, feelings, and experience. keeping the dream alive by the sheer force of this global thumping! as long as we who push the sound are doing so from the true love of how it makes us feel, and wanting to share that is coming from a non-selfish motivation.... the scene will continue to grow and hopefully enrich the lives of others who will take the energy that the global movement has been generating and spread it out into thier lives, into the universe.
as some sort of final statement:
at EVERY SINGLE tranceparty ive ever been to , there was someone, at least 1, and at times it was me, who danced and danced, and found thier peace and clarity and presence and oneness with thier body and mind and the universe, it all makes sense for that moment, and THATS WHAT ITS ALL ABOUT!
not who spends the most, not who has the headliners, not who has the best vibe, not who has tshirts with thier crew's name, not who has the best soundsystem, the best deco, the newest tracks, the best shineyest flyers, who can beatmatch the best, who has the biggest cock. hehehe
its about that ONE person at a time reaching thier samadhi, if only for that one instant. thats where our power lies.
in providing environments for that moment to occur.
in enjoying our lives and doing what enriches us and puts us more directly on the path toward truth and righteousness and sustainability and peace.
 www.bluespectralmonkey.com
www.touchsamadhi.com
www.interchill.com
www.metacrew.com
www.nw-psy.com |
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Surrender
IsraTrance Team
Started Topics :
506
Posts :
5388
Posted : Oct 14, 2004 18:59
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basically what it comes down to is what i define an event of quality to begin with. what suits me, i have high demands from myself and sometimes i forget that people do not have those demands as i do. if those basic things arent there all working together at the same time, im not satisfied. i can say that even in ET events i wasnt always satisfied.
you misread me if you think im about arrogance or "the biggest cock". i demand quality first and foremost of myself. i find it hard to enjoy things in every other aspect of life if they do not fit my standards. anyone who knows me personally can testify to that.
in my view, the west coast seems to posses something i have experienced in other spots of the world that the east coast lacks. without arrogance i can say i have seen sparks of it and moments of it in ecliptic parties and it did exist in synthetic sadhus parties on a much bigger scale. the whole idea of ecliptic was to remedy a situation instead of sitting at home and bitching. after this whole time i can tell you we faced nothing but obstacles. its not the purpose of this thread to talk about this subject but its going in about every direction possible here... from critique to personal attacks. so to come back to what this topic is about...i dont understand why some people dont like to take some judgement from time to time - its healthy for fixing some problems that obviously exist, otherwise the judegement and bitching wouldnt come up in the first place.
one last time regarding DMT events:
"an avoided disaster at best" this is due to the fact that the venues are often illegal and anyone who has thrown a party in nyc knows its not a good idea... ask Gavin or El-Nadiv.. they can tell you the hardship of having your party shut down due to an illegal venue/space.
Dj's - The dj's who cannot beatmix and have mp3's for tracks know who they are, i have no problem dishing this out to them, if it offends them, they need to recheck the word dj. it means much more then just being a human jukebox, it means much more then being connected to soulseek and dc connect. there is no excuse since the DAT has been out of use to not know how to mix.. this music (especially today's) is MADE for mixing, there are obvious "MIX-OUT NOW" signals and sounds in the tracks, and anyone who takes thmeselves with any respect needs to step it up before they perform, YES, perform infront of a crowd.
the dj's who CAN mix know who they are as well. they are not offended by me since it was never aimed at them.
now, jeff - take this critism and do what want with it, its only meant to better a situation that im not even in anymore.
people dont have the same philosophy as i do regarding party organizing. i believe that an organizer is like a captain of a ship, where the dancers are your passangers. you must navigate them through a voyage safely from start to finish. an illegal venue here (especially nyc) is like navigating through a mine field - "an avoided disaster at best". at ecliptic we tried to follow this philosophy and did our best to keep our passangers both safe and happy. after all its a party and as seriously as i take it, its also about fun and a good time. on another note, i dont think anybody saw me dancing ever at those events... i was too busy "steering the ship" as i shouldve been. if anyone noticed i took myself off from playing ecliptic events cause i believed i have a responisblity to the event, more then my ego who wanted to perform and adding that to the list of things may hinder my goal. the goal was to elevate nyc and beyond to trance dominance.
i feel kinda weird having to write this about myself here, but it would seem everyone is too scared or unwilling to post anything to back up anything im saying, so i must.
"On the other hand, you have different fingers."
http://myspace.com/gadimon |
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malachi
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
32
Posts :
354
Posted : Oct 14, 2004 19:29
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Maybe that's the beauty of the DMT
events...The risk.
You can't get that type of
experience anywhere else in the world,
than in New York City!!!
I'm not speaking on quality here. I'm
speaking on experience. Not everything
can be neat and tidy. I can't think of
a more insane psychedelic experience than
having New York City walking up above me
and people seriously getting down below.
No rules...just peeps and trance going until
the afternoon. I feel for ya if you haven't
had the chance to get with that!
Also, I don't recall any DMT bridge parties
being shut down lately.
It's all one big psy-pi and you gots to
have the tasty crust along with the
fruits brotha to get the taste of the
whole pi.
Love Boms,
Luke Malachi
-Gadi said:
one last time regarding DMT events:
"an avoided disaster at best" this is due to the fact that the venues are often illegal and anyone who has thrown a party in nyc knows its not a good idea... ask Gavin or El-Nadiv.. they can tell you the hardship of having your party shut down due to an illegal venue/space. |
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ZeRo
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
39
Posts :
802
Posted : Oct 14, 2004 19:29
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gadi, i and for sure everyone who has every met you or been to an ET event knows that your heart and mind were in the right place and all of your efforts were pure..... for sure.
but we(at least i) are going to miss the ecliptic trance events. the dark soho/total eclipse ch. 1 party was my first REAl psytrance party. tsunami doesnt count and previously i had just had my cds.
were going to miss you.
ein chadash tachat hashemesh. there is nothing new under the sun. --kohelet. |
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Berzerx
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
51
Posted : Oct 15, 2004 07:33
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to jeff machinelf
About fun and serious:
do i look fucking corporate to you? everything we did in ecliptic trance was from the love to trance and a vision to create a better scene. why do u say that serious is the opposite of fun? love is fun and u must take it seriously otherwise it will slip between your fingers. thats why we took everything more seriously so you will have more fun. not only for your fun that is for your safety too and the promise of continuation in future events in that venue so they will vontinue to take us seriously.
about the things you say about drugs:
ok you in understand you do alot of drugs, youre so cool that youre destroying the scene even before it started. i dont think you can do bigger parties because of the things you say. the way that you think that the more drugs the better is like supersizing fries, it looks like youre trying to push more drugs to the community like mcdonalds pushes more fries to its customers. true hippies are not drug hoags, the heroes of fear and loathing are not hippies they are just pigs. looks funny from the outside. its funny sometimes to see in a party somebody let loose on drugs. somebody runs naked or says funny things or do something funny. not so funny to see your friend throwing paint all over the place and on art and other people's property. ok maybe i wouldnt care if it was a nature party. its not even funny at all when every second somebody is asking to buy drugs from the club's owner who stay and monitor. how do you think he feels about the future of our parties? especially when there are undercover cops patrolling. this is by the way why we had a problem with the alcohol, the cigarrettes and the re-entry at the last party.
About ecliptic trance
a month ago you told everyone out loud that ecliptic trance is the best thing right now in new york, so now you call us commerical and putting us in the same category as the other promoters. nobody gave more to the crowd then ecliptic trance in the east coast. we werent commercial cause the artists that we brought werent commerical. logic bomb was the biggest sales wise and he sold around 10000 total, which is very good for psy producers but still nothing compared to commerical artists. everything was created in the most serious way and therefore you got the best deco the best sounds the best live acts the best flyers. we were the only ones who gave freebies to the crowd nonstop to the crowd. your ticket money went back into you. the most important thing is that each and everyone got personal treatment from us. tell me if its true or not, dont lie because youre angry right now.
About money.
so bringing these "superstars" still costs money, lots of it. you need to fly them, feed, take care of them like brothers so they can give back to you their best. what is the best? the best is to play new material, bonuses that you cant find on mp3, real sound and real energy. when a local dj who plays for you mp3 from a year ago without beatmixing without understanding the building of a set without understanding the sound, he just cant give me those things the "superstar" can. so its expensive for you? im sorry, there is nothing to do about it, we live in nyc probably the most expensive city in the usa. everything here is more expensive the flyers, the drinks and ofcourse the venue expects to make more money. thats why we had to take "alot" of money from you - so we can give it all back.
you said before that gadi left ecliptic trance because he didnt succeed. didnt succeed what? ecliptic trance is a house hold name in the east coast. he just left the game from another reason that youre refusing to understand. we will continue.
do i need to see a friend who is so loaded on drugs that he is trying to sneak somebody into the party infront of our face without paying? why do my other friends need to pay full price to provide the money to make everything happen to make the guy who didnt pay enjoy and then go outside and bitch about our party? so u still think its too much money? dmt is doing free ones, go there.
but if u want a live act with good sound and killer deco, u need to help us a little.
i must say again that i dont have nothing against drugs, but the way its going on here is very annoying. everybody is so overloaded that they dont see that even we made mistakes. i rather people see the mistakes so there will be a reason to fix them. i dont want to see the ny scene dont give a fuck about mistakes. i no longer listen to some people when they tell me i had a good set, cause most of the time they have no clue what is going on. this kills the art of mixing and building a set.
look what weve been through in the last year and a half - people threatening our lives after they got paid for working for us. people sneaking in our parties with the exchange of entry stamps, this is why we made the bracelets. we had a community man snkeaing people into our party. we were called commercial and greedy. all this after we gave you the best sound system in the scene, maybe not spirits - but the best in the psytrane scene. by the way, in brainmachines.com we are still raided medium sound system party. the hottest international artists playing live on all the equipment they could desire the best deco in the east coast. all artists got paid as they desired and they did in return everything to transform the space into a trance environment. every party the deco was better, we always went up, in the last party the deco was insane. free things throught the night, and everything we could to make you feel more comfortable.
after every party you told us that we are the best, and to keep on doing this. and now that we said something about your system you throw mud in our face and say every thing opposite of what you said to everyone to this day.
most of the people that can do a really good party in the east coast dont want to risk their money and time in building something where a drugged out guy will say its shit but still try to sneak in for free.
peace to ny.
home is where the bong is
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Machinelf
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
10
Posts :
37
Posted : Oct 15, 2004 16:21
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It's a little bit funny that you can slam my personal drug use on this list but I can't point out what your day job is. I moderate lists all the time, maybe this is my karma catching up with me LOL
I think that most promoters are doing it backwards, that's my DIY opinion. Rather than save up a bunch of money, rent everything you use then blow it all in one weekend and maybe lose a fortune and end up with nothing (and maybe even embittered..), why not invest in equipment and pay for it by renting it out to others, why not focus on building a community, why not seek out outdoor locations that are free, why not focus on throwing killer free events and get people motivated to donate? That's what we do, and it works. We don't lose money because we don't spend hardly any. We have had DJs here from all over the country and world playing in the open air. The cost to get them here is borne by donations. Sure, you miss some people who don't have the balls to sstep out of their club-shoeboxed mentality but losing ucreative people isn't a negative.
Usually there's aprocess where an organizer of these commercial indoor events try to rise to the top, and fool themselves by surrounding themselves with yes men. Sometimes, they do a lot of coke or something that similarly masturbates the ego.
When the money runs out (asd it always does) they blame everyone else but themlslves. I've seen this happen several times.
The DMT does not and has never done events in "illegal venues". We do it either in the park where the NYPD knows about us (and sometimes leaves a cop car and ambulance at the top of the huill) or one time for the Boston peeps a private living spaces.
Again, Gadi, get your facts straight.
I only came here on this list to straighten you out about DMT events. That's it. Now that that is done, I have to go back to work. There is a job to do. There are drugs to do, parties to plan, people to have sex with. Talk to me when you're doing parties again.
The generator has never broken down and the sound system is operational. Everything else is fluff.
Don't know a DJ until you hear them... since each event revolved around a different city on the east Coast, you are dissing basically every crew from boston, pittsburgh, philly, new jersey. The fact that you do this without actually being there completely invalidates the rest of your negative rant.
>the generator(s) do have problems
WRONG. Ask anyone who has ever been. The generator has never broken down. Wrong. It's a Honda.
>and there is a certain feeling of unprofressionalism regarding the whole thing. being pro. about something doesnt mean its commercial, it simply means all angles are covered.
D.I.Y. baby! I'll leave the angles to the "promoters"
We do free events because that's our decision. And nobody will burn our bridges.
As for me destroying the scene with drugs, Gadi, I have been here since before Tsunami's Liberty Science Center party and I was on a lot of acid for that one. No one is gonna tell me what I can or can't do, keep your laws out of my body.
Re: Ecliptic Trance, you are at once comparing our events saying yours is better production (when ours are free, and yours cost $$$) and then you get mad when I point this out that you are comparing apples to oranges. As I have said before, Gadi, you can't have it both ways and we wouldnt even be having this conversation if you had not tried to dis the Devotional Minsitry of Trance with erroneous slams.
Now maybe I am taking this incoorectly (as its always the risk as we veer from my orgional complaint with you - the generator/sound system/review by absentee thing) but you seem to be blaming anyone who abuses drugs on me. I have a short shitlist of people in NYC whose actions disallow them from our events. Often they are irresponsible poly drug abusers. If they continue to fuck up, they stay on the list. www.brainmachines.com/shitlist.html
I did everything I could to warn you about one of the drugged out shitlisters whose list of crtimes is pretty motley - Raffi - but you told me in a firm way that I was not allowed to take any action against him at your party. So you let him in anyway and he fucked you over - why are you bringing this up? He's not my friend, he's a walking liability. Are you somehow saying that Raffi is my somehow fault because I condone responsible drug use? This is starting to sound like a presidential debate. Get outta heah!
And finally, when I say you are the best, I must have been on MDMA at the time because there are other event organizers here and I would hate for them to get jealous. OTOH, your negative and false statements regarding all of our efforts puts everything in a different light. With a trance event it's very hard to be completely objective, the motives of the people behind it play a lot into it. That's a judgement call, if I am dislike an artist it's hard for me to appreciate their work. Sometimes over the years I hold my nose when booking djs because they are so damn good (but are assholes IMHO) but not often. There are plenty of great people out there though that are indeed merely fans of music and play the same old crap. I went through a period a while back where my take was that djs are a dime a dozen, and that the Event itself was paramount. In ceratin situations that holds true. But in general it's an alchemy that's important, sound, dj, people, and yes great psychedelics IMHO that must all be there in what Aristotle called the Golden Mean for it all to sufficiently pull you into a trance. Or, you could just say crew all that and put on brainmachines heh |
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BrettFromTibet
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
61
Posts :
749
Posted : Oct 15, 2004 16:33
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Surrender..
I didn't get to go to an ET event... but I must say it ---looked like- the most professional, balanced and solid attempt to organize trance culture, in a viable location, in the USA! The good intention and hard work you were putting into it was very apparent from 3,000 miles away! very best of luck...and consider a move to the 'promised land' in the west - you seem to have the vibe and mentality for out here.
man, i was considering moving to NYC because it has real jobs, a trance scene, and great airline connections to the world - but i'm glad i reckoned it would be too much of a jungle to deal with.
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Eklypz
Started Topics :
7
Posts :
359
Posted : Oct 15, 2004 17:53
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Only in NYC will be people knock free events.
It is AWESOME that people are doing renegades. I thought those were only reserved for London these days.
Some of my best experiences at parties "back in the day" were renegades on the west cost pre '96. Full Moon Raves by Wicked especially come to mind.
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Berzerx
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
51
Posted : Oct 15, 2004 18:20
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Jeff the last post was from me, not Gady
home is where the bong is
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Machinelf
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
10
Posts :
37
Posted : Oct 15, 2004 20:05
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I am done with this topic of the viability of trance in the U.S.
If anyone has any questions about the hard cold facts about free gatherings in the NYC area (that may or may not conform to the edict of this forum of having Israeli djs - that's why this forum isn't used to publicize our activities) please email me offline. Or if you have events you'd like to publicize to NYC area trance heads let me know and I will get the good word out. Otherwise I have zero interest in any exchanges of hot air. The open air season is over - it's been a busy long summer and 2004 will be remembered warmly for many, and we at the Devotional Ministry of Trancesexual Wackos are taking a hiatus until next spring. However, there will be fundraisers thorughout the winter, we just need to firm up some venues and lineups. So for the rest of you impecunious crusties - until next year - ROCK ON! Gadi - good luck in whatever you do! Mike - keep the good vibes flowing! And the rest of you - don't give up - a network of brains is better than toiling in isolation. |
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