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East coast/West coast
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malachi
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
32
Posts :
354
Posted : Oct 13, 2004 22:28
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Wow...I'm just happy that Cleveland is even
mentioned in this fine thread.
I will add that the DMT bridge party event we played at last May was probably the most gratifiying and
fullfilling trance event (for me personally) I have
ever had the chance to experience. Very raw
indeed. Just the way I like it.
That's just me though. My Scene knows no
borders. I know we'll be gettin down
at the wayne county possum farms on
the 23rd.
Peace and Blessings |
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Maska
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
27
Posts :
869
Posted : Oct 13, 2004 22:32
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Dude (Machine Elf), it depends on what you consider better?
Do you mean numbers or the vibe?
I know personally that we in LA have great love and pure tranceness at our parties...I wouldn't give that up for anything, anywhere.....To top it off, Jan from Xdream and many others have told me the same thing...
So, I don't know...It depends on what you consider better......I don't feel we are inferior to any other scene, but rather less populated. Besides, you go by mushroom mag? I bet none of them have been to a party here, so how can they judge?
 assumption is the mother of all fuckups. |
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mist
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
68
Posts :
642
Posted : Oct 13, 2004 22:34
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Machinelf
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
10
Posts :
37
Posted : Oct 13, 2004 22:47
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I have never been to a trance party in L.A. so I can't judge. I'd love to I bet there is a lot of opportunity for all night beach parties - or is that impossible? The articles I write mostly center on NYC and northern Cal and I think that's an easy way out. And while we're talking, I wanna throw some props to Gadi for starting this most ineteresting of threads.
As to what I consider "better" i think in addition to the regular stuff (access to cheap beautiful outdoor locations, a connected family oriented scene, a group mechanism for ejecting assholes, a crowd consisting of the whole spectrum of www.brainmachines.com/trancespotting.html and an abundance of that pernnially indescribable female Gaian vibe, some quality and quantity of available psychedelics is very important. Those of you who may disagree should talk to people in Wisconsin who try to throw parties on music alone...
>Dude (Machine Elf), it depends on what you consider better?
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mist
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
68
Posts :
642
Posted : Oct 13, 2004 23:17
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Quote:
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On 2004-10-13 22:47, Machinelf wrote:
...some quality and quantity of available psychedelics is very important. Those of you who may disagree should talk to people in Wisconsin who try to throw parties on music alone... |
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That is absurd! That sort of thinking is also a reason the government is so keen on cracking down on electronic music/parties/club in general.
And I will say to you all, that I've been involved with the goa/psy scene for quite some time, and I have NEVER (as in never-ever) heard/experienced psy on psychedelics. They are NOT key to the enjoyment of the music, and if you think they are... Parties should be about the music and the people, not about the drugs.
Disagree with me if you'd like, but we're speaking of throwing parties in America, and in America such drugs are illegal. Nothing will get your party shut down faster. Which is why responsible promoters make efforts (ie:show due dilligence) to keep drugs out of their parties...
Are you connected to yourself?
http://soundcloud.com/justincaseboy |
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Machinelf
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
10
Posts :
37
Posted : Oct 13, 2004 23:33
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i am only saying for what I have seen. I am not saying it is good or bad, it just seems to be one of the many things that go into what makes an event complete. my thinking is that it's not called psychedelic for nothing. I think this is true for almost everyone I know, and that i think that to say it's NOT true is wishful thinking laden with good intentions. Of course, YMMV and excess of anything is undesirable. And a self correction mechanism within the scene to coax rampant drug users to lighten their load and bit and give sobriety a chance. This gets to the kernel of the argument between me and Gadi. I am a drug user and occasional abuser, and he is not. That's it. BTW I have also tried doing drugs at parties that I am somehow responsible for, and it goes to hell! I'm talking an injection of anumal tranquilizer into the chest muscle in an illegal environment. It's fun but very risky. Some people are addicted to pyuching the edge. There's a limit, though, but skirting the Edge is what makes trance so much fun (within limits):
Taking conscious risk involves overcoming our instincts. No other animal intentionally puts itself in peril. The human race is particularly risk taking compared with other species. Risk takers include the Type T personality, and the U.S. as a Type T nation, as opposed to more risk-averse nations like Japan. Type T physical includes extreme athletes and Type T intellectual include Albert Einstein, Terrence McKenna, Karl Jansen, Alex Grey, and Galileo. There is also Type T negative, that is, those who are drawn to bad haircuts, delinquency, crime, hedonistic descent into drug addiction, unprotected sex and a whole litany of destructive behaviors.
All these Type Ts are related, and perhaps even different aspects of the same character trait. There is a direct link between Einstein and BASE jumper Chance McGuire. They are different manifestations of the thrill-seeking component of our characters: Einstein was thrilled by his mental life, and McGuire--well, Chance jumps off buildings.
The question is, How much is enough? Without some expression of risk, we may never know our limits and therefore who we are as individuals. "If you don't assume a certain amount of risk," says paraglider pilot Wade Ellet, 51, "you're missing a certain amount of life." And it is by taking risks that we may flirt with greatness. We create technologies, we make new discoveries , we enhance the concrescence of reality , but in order to do that, we have to push beyond the set of rules that are governing us at that time. Western communities are very happy to challenge and stretch themselves physically - in fact, this is considered a very healthy and acceptable activity - but investigating the depths of the mind in a similarly extreme way can be considered illegal, if not heretical. However, one could consider the rhythmic transcendentalism of trance the bungey jump of the mind.
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Tinker
Started Topics :
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3
Posted : Oct 13, 2004 23:43
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I'd like to point out one simple fact of all this.
Gadi...is a *NYC* promoter. If the New York scene sucks, then I guess he's just not doing his job very well either.
I personally believe that the antagonistic local government is hurting all scenes in New York. And as I said on the DMT list about this topic. New York isn't suited to having "psy-trance" scenes or "jungle" scenes etc... It's a melting pot, and if you don't try to make your scene a melting pot it's just not going to fly in New York.
I promote in New York city, my crew Dysco Noir has worked with many different crews including industrial, psy-trance, jungle, house, IDM, Techno etc... and I've gotten A LOT of support from people here, everytime we throw a party we have more help from the larger scene than we did at the party before.
The New York scene is phenomenal if you don't try to limit it to just "psy-trance" but that's just what people do, and that's part of the reason it ends up being lame, because if someone plays a psychedelic techno track in their set, people start to bitch.
Not only that but New York is grittier. Everyone I know that goes from New York to San Francisco finds that a New York attitude seems super abrasive out in San Francisco. The basic fact is, New York isn't like San Fran, and shouldn't try to be San Fran.
If you like San Fran so much, by all means, I extend you a friendly "Get the f*** out and go where you'll enjoy yourself more".
And to anyone making a point about New York parties being expensive, I don't know very many people getting rich throwing parties. If the city would stop shutting down all the underground venues by not renewing their cabaret licenses, then perhaps it would be less expensive. Places like Volume and Lunatarium where they have $ 10 parties have trouble renewing their cabaret licenses due to an antagonistic political climate.
Not only that, but I am extremely non-plussed by the superstar cock-rock psy acts that get imported from Israel or Europe, and make the parties expensive.
Erek |
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Machinelf
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
10
Posts :
37
Posted : Oct 14, 2004 01:15
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2 other things... this may be veering off the EastCoast/West Coast topic, but there two thoughts here..
can we get beyond the word "promoter"? it makes someone sound like Don King...
also re: the drug issue, without LSD there would not have been hippies and no Summer of Love. Hippies without acid = dirty beatniks and who wants those alcoholics? we could argue until the cows come in about how many angels can dance on the head of a pin, but there's no mistake that NoCal has a great scene and is a traditional source of acid. (well, not counting fairly recently depending on who you ask) and the original trance heads of which our efforts are an echo - he tribal shaman types hosted ceremonies where natives would take whatever psychoactive substances that were around, and sometimes just threw it all into a DMT laced energy drink LOL notwithstanding the appropriateness (or not) of the glaring dislocation for a Westerner to do major psychedelics in a Western setting, try getting on a time travel amchine and going back and pontificating on there drug use. They'd probably eat you too  Drugs are everywhere, and in your brain too - watch "What the Bleep fdo we know" for an excellent portrayal of neurochemicals
Let me say it here: To paraphrase Terence McKenna, If you love psy-trance and have never "ever taken a psychedelic substance, it's like going to the grave without ever having sex. It means that you have never figured out what it was all about. The Mystery is in the Body, and the way the Body works itself into nature."
But dude - keep throwing good parties with Neuromotor in TX. If you can do that without drugs by all means, stay the fuck away from them!! |
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David(KIVA)
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
36
Posts :
487
Posted : Oct 14, 2004 01:31
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Surrender
IsraTrance Team
Started Topics :
506
Posts :
5388
Posted : Oct 14, 2004 01:54
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Quote:
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On 2004-10-13 23:43, Tinker wrote:
Gadi...is a *NYC* promoter.
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Gadi...WAS a *NYC* promoter.
and dude pm me in private, i have no idea who you are.
"On the other hand, you have different fingers."
http://myspace.com/gadimon |
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Machinelf
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
10
Posts :
37
Posted : Oct 14, 2004 03:51
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IM i got just now, and this from an SF "scene leader" (whatever that is...) (i can't make this stuff up!)
Ismokedmt: can u give me 150 words on the nocal/northwest trance scene plus a photo by tonight plz? for entrance mag?
[name deleted to protect the guilty]: i can give you two words - it sucks |
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paradigm
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
54
Posts :
1098
Posted : Oct 14, 2004 04:55
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Im not going to enter this what city or scene is better battle.
All i have to say is
Everyone is so caught up on trying to make the US scene bigger. Its our small size that gives us uniqueness that we have. yeah a constant influx of new people is needed to sustain a scene, but beyond that, if the scene grows so do the problems.
Alot international acts will turn down competing bookings for chances to come and play here. I know this is true for SF, La, Oregon, and Texas. Why? because our scene is small and somehwat pure. The US has one of the best vibes on the planet, scary as that is. We dont have the Russian mob showing up at gates to our events and robbing us over the barrel of a uzi. We dont have gypsies wandering our festivals and robbing us blind.
Growth has its benefits and its consequences
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BrettFromTibet
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
61
Posts :
749
Posted : Oct 14, 2004 05:32
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man, i love you guys. yep, even you "evil" guys. east coast and west coast too.
you all are a rare and different species of humanity, a genuine american
psytrancer - someone who is onto something way before it's known and exploited. I criedl when the warm freaky urban vibes of house music got turned into snobby cocktail club culture - and the real house fans are forever forlon and remmebering how it used to be.
i really do love this moment in time - this moment of embryonic fluster. maybe it's just been a long day and the ambient music is getting to my head - but if the space time trance continnum had a pause button - i'd hit it right about here.
*** This is the "good old days" you'll MISS IN 10 YEARS! ****
where cops have never even heard of a trance party , per se. where airheads and frat boys aren't showing up at parties because it became "cool". where little secret things
go on and friends tell friends. and MTV
has no psy videos. and you don't hear Shpongle in the mall.
God Bless America -
From the Walmart SuperCenter
to the Playa - Black Rock City
From NYC and XTC,
Atlanta to humbolt county
florida keys, SUVs and LSD -
and sea to shining sea -
we've got the best in the world!
whenever i'm out and about and (sterotype-minded) europeans
pick on me for being American... and claim my country has no culture - i look 'em square in the eye and say "yeah - we'll we invented skateboarding, surfing, rock-n-roll, and psychedeic counterculture! that's the american culture i love!" and they shut up.
jah love - feel the positive i and i vibration! Bom bolenath! |
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Tinker
Started Topics :
0
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3
Posted : Oct 14, 2004 05:51
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I gotta say man, you all live in a different bucket than I do.
Psy-trance is used in car commercials. Half of the songs in the Matrix were psy-trance. psy-trance is acid techno with 10 less bpms and a few years of experience. The scene isn't "burgeoning". I have heard VERY few "fresh" psy acts in a long time.
Psy-trance elitism is beginning to remind me of Industrial elitism back in the day. So I guess this is the good old days for some, and I am happy for you that it is. But now it's on it's way out as far as I'm concerned. The term psy-trance has turned into a cliche.
But don't misunderstand me, the vibe, the intensity, the concepts of psy-trance are pure, and they'll move on, but psy-trance is moving the way of aging hippies. I don't know how many times I've been to a psy-trance party and heard mention of how great it is that it's an older crowd and the younger kids aren't there. To me that sucks, freshness and vitality are found in the youth. The word psy-trance has become trite and cliche. The rest of it, the spirituality the conciousness expansion and all that, is great, but it was never limited to psy-trance, it's not unique to psy-trance and when psy-trance becomes as unhip to say as "Rave" there will be another thing that will fill the void but will have aspects that are fresh and new. Psy-trance is dead my friends, it's over, but the energy will live on as it always has. From ancient ayahuascueros to Timothy Leary and Terrence McKenna, to Goa Gil and so on.
The word has outlived it's usefulness, it's gathered too much baggage, and elitism is rife. It's too codified, too rigid, any manipulation of the meme engenders a cry of "Hey that's not psy-trance, this is a psy-trance party!", that's the cry of the inevitable. Just think about all those punks who sat around arguing whether something was punk or not for the last 20 years.
I've watched many scenes in a state of decay. I've seen Punk's funeral, I've seen Industrial go it's way, I've seen rock and roll churn out the same album with a different pretty face with charmingly tousled hair since I was a little kid. It's psy-trance's turn now.
And I have to agree with Jeff, without acid there would be no psy-trance. Sure you can enjoy it without drugs, but that tee-tolling attitude is ludicrous. This scene would not exist without the drugs, and that's just the way it is, own it, accept it and move on.
It's time to come up with a new and fresh sound, I'm tired of hearing "The newest and hottest track to barely change GMSs sound coming out of Israel just last week!"
Don't get me wrong, I like psy-trance, but I really hate when people talk about it as something it's not. And underground is something it's not. Psy-trance is as mainstream as Booty House.
Erek |
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Tinker
Started Topics :
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3
Posted : Oct 14, 2004 06:33
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And one more thing. The DMT generator lovingly dubbed "Kali" is brand new, and I have yet to hear a story of it not working. The DMT sound system, though it has seen it's trials and tribulations is top notch, and very few underground DIY crews have access to the same equipment.
As I've mentioned I flow in many New York scenes, and every single person that I've taken to a DMT bridge party from those various scenes has absolutely loved it. |
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