Plasmorh
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Posted : Dec 9, 2010 22:39
Quote:
On 2010-12-09 21:20, psychowave wrote:
dissonant are not music imo..just noise...
one or other dissonant element, in a little small portion can be good, ok...but a music made all by dissonance??? or also a constant dissonant phrase... seens like no music for me...
-1
this is tech music were talkind abt... everything is possible...
so minimal with clicks and blips isnt music aswell --'
I want a spare brain.... or 2.
orgytime
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Posted : Dec 9, 2010 23:30
i think those sounds are developing nice if your matrix (all other sounds) is right. that means if you have some kind of a melody, and then one note is out of tune.
www.soundcloud.com/orgytime
br0d
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Posted : Dec 10, 2010 07:49
Dissonance rules man
Just toss an banana on the keyboard and you have a jazz chord...be sure to press record first. C#dim9
Vermeee
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Posted : Dec 10, 2010 23:04
Quote:
On 2010-12-09 22:39, Plasmorh wrote:
Quote:
On 2010-12-09 21:20, psychowave wrote:
dissonant are not music imo..just noise...
one or other dissonant element, in a little small portion can be good, ok...but a music made all by dissonance??? or also a constant dissonant phrase... seens like no music for me...
-1
this is tech music were talkind abt... everything is possible...
so minimal with clicks and blips isnt music aswell --'
i also dont agree with it... and givin a more scientifical side coz some people like it :
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Definition of music
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia :
How to define music has long been the subject of debate; philosophers, musicians, and, more recently, various social and natural scientists have argued about what constitutes music. The definition has varied through history, in different regions, and within societies. Definitions vary as music, like art, is a subjectively perceived phenomenon. Its definition has been tackled by philosophers of art, lexicographers, composers, music critics, musicians, semioticians or semiologists, linguists, sociologists, and neurologists. Music may be defined according to various criteria including organization, pleasantness, intent, social construction, perceptual processes and engagement, universal aspects or family resemblances, and through contrast or negative definition.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Shiranui
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Posted : Dec 11, 2010 17:49
Music has always used dissonance, mostly as a point of contrast to consonance
psychowave
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Posted : Dec 12, 2010 13:43
ok, let's correct...its not music to my ears...
As I say before, dissonant elements, sometimes can be good to bring the listener to a weird sensation...as shiranui say, to contrast with the consonance...
But a music made just of dissonant elements as the topic says...cmon guys...we are talking about trance music here, or dance music, in a general way...who of you can dance a entire dissonant music???
Quote:
this is tech music were talkind abt
I dont know what is a tech music, but I will interpret as technology...music created with technology devices, ways, techniques...pls correct me if Im wrong...
but form me, that's one of reasons that we have a lot of poor quality electronic music nowadays...many ppl only take care about technical stuff of audio, putting your brain into a tech theories and tutorials pool..and forgetting the music...
IMO, the "core" of music, its the note, cause a note make difference between a noise and music...a good way to arrange many notes together in different timbres and harmony all that together its music for me...
aciduss
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Posted : Dec 12, 2010 17:57
^ Subjective blah blah blah...
Koozer Mox
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Posted : Dec 12, 2010 19:37
if we are talking about a melody thru a MIDI or in a piano roll, the trick is on the Seminotes, if u have few notes, or a melody already made, u can add few semitones here and there, u will feel that spookyness ur talking about, for example adding a C sharp after a normal C, or it doenst have to be JUST after the note, but yes, semitones are the key for this, and pitch lfo = rox, i know alot of artist who used dissonant stuff and i really love the way they apply it to their music, u just need the perfect atmosphere and precise moment to add them, for example u wont add a spooky synth or melody while a morning happy pad is in the background
PoM
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Posted : Dec 12, 2010 19:50
with dissonant i was thinking to detuned sound that sound dark cause of the strange pitch , it could be a preset or a chord for example , i m not sure dissonant is the good word to describe what i m talking about. correct me if i m wrong but for me some synth patchs can sound dissonant on their own , the pitch can still sound good with the track but it s like it s not really in tune and can sound very dark cause of that .so it s not really about the midi line , the dissonant effect is right from the sound itself , that what i meant with making a track with only dissonant sounds.
aciduss
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Posted : Dec 13, 2010 00:12
You are talking about the same thing, it can be dissonance from the synth itself (from detuned oscs, lfo -> pitch ) or the notes being played, at the end it is just a mater of harmonic relationship, one is from the synth's timbre other from the intervals played.
Maine Coon
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Posted : Dec 13, 2010 15:42
This is all very subjective.
The types of harmonies used in modern music would get a composer in very big troubles in medieval times. Forget medieval – even as late as 1800s. It’s really more about what your ears are used to.
Jazz sounds dissonant to most classics’ fans I know – in part, because of the semitone trick Koozer described.
Arabic classical songs (not Egyptian synth pop) often sound off-key to me. But this is because Arabic scales use 1/4-tones instead of 1/2-tones, so many notes fall in between the pitches my Western ears expect. Yet, they sound perfectly harmonic to people who grew up on those songs.
About dissonant synth patches: I read somewhere that there is a degree of detuning that most people find unsettling. Cannot find that info now. I think it was something like 10 Hz, not totally sure…
PoM
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Posted : Dec 13, 2010 17:06
aciduss can you tell me more about that harmonics relation ship, it s like these dissonant sound (like the sample i uplaoded for example) have strong inharmonic content that may be excalty why they have this effet on us ,but it can make them hard to tune to other sounds of a track .
i m checking the net and there is lot of intresting stuff about this.. i always did by ears but i m looking at the technical side , i m understanding a bit more all this thanks everyone for your inputs.
PoM
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Posted : Dec 13, 2010 17:28
i find some great tricks to explore , like a dreamy pad (mdma pad style)to morph into a dissonant ,dark sounding thing by slowly automating the oscillators tuning and unisson or with modulation using the mod wheel,could sound great !
aciduss
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Posted : Dec 13, 2010 17:52
Well i am no eminence here but i can try...
See everything in harmony is about relationships between tones: intervals...
Simple relationships like an octave say for example C1 and C2 ratio is 2:1 because C2 frequency is doubled.
In harmony they use roman numerals for refering to the pitch of tones no mater what tone u are at so in this example C is I next most harmonic relationship is the perfect fifth(V), for C it would be G, relationship is 3:2 which sounds pleasent to the ear...
And so on, next harmonic would be the fourth (IV) and then the third, then seventh, then sixth, then second grade and then you can play with diminished tones to add more weirdness since relationships would be much more complex... that is the way your brain percieves harmonic relationship to be pleasent when consonant and unpleasent when dissonant, although a nice composition is often taken through a consonance - dissonance drama.
So as you can guess, complex relationship between tones gives the sensation of tension or relaxation when they are simple...
you can learn more if you read about Pythagoras and the technical principles of music, golden ratio and such stuff...
Here, a fun way to do so:
hope it helps...
very interesting stuff indeed.
You can try experimenting by playing various notes together (chords) or tuning different oscs to different tones... say one to I another to V (very housey synth xD) or whatever relationship you are aiming for...
A very interesting relationship is the tritone which was, in medieval times considered a diabolic one...
I think it was something like 10 Hz, not totally sure…
