Nectarios
Martian Arts
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187
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5292
Posted : Feb 3, 2011 19:53
Quote:
On 2011-02-03 19:15, aciduss wrote:
PS. DH & Mike: you project so much rage to Moki's way of seeing life just because you can't see it the same way.
Not at all, I am indifferent to her ideas as I have yet to actually hear all the stuff she claims is so amazing.
There was a massive thread about the cosmic octave, like two years ago that was like 40 pages.
To sum it up really bluntly:
Quote:
Moki: "My explorations in cosmic sounds has led me to this cosmic fine tuning of middle A to 428Hz (instead of 440Hz), cause that way you get propa melodies that awake the chakras. You've all been doing it wrong all these years."
Quite a few chaps including my self:
"Piss Off."
Moki: "Its true me friend is doing it and I can tell you, this tuing takes people to the outer rings of Saturn and back. 428Hz>440Hz.
A few random tree huggin' acid casualties: "Moki, I like what you're saying. Wow, it must be true, although I have never heard any of it".
Quite a few chaps including my self:
":lol:"
Moki: "It's true, my friends makes pure trance tunes because of the new tuning I have read on teh internets. I also make this amazing music, using special programms...neener neener".
Quite a few chaps including my self:
"Ok, let's hear it."
Moki: "Nope, you are not worthy and you wouldn't understand it anyway".
Quite a few chaps including my self:
"Piss off"
Moki: "You hurt my feelings. Now I am going and I am never coming back to share my incredible psychedelic wisdom, farewell."
Quite a few chaps including my self:
":lol:"
So you see there is more to it than this thread. And it is cool that you like stuff that is hard to believe and difficult to digest by the logical analytical mind, but saying you like it and claiming you can prove it exists because you've done it, but won't share it with the rest of the world, because we're not worthy, are two different things all together.
Anyhow, good to see Moki posting on here again, even if she created an awful lot of drama about leaving this place, and left, never to return (like 5 times)
aciduss
IsraTrance Full Member
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1490
Posted : Feb 3, 2011 19:57
Oh I didn't know Moki was a "she"...
loki
IsraTrance Junior Member
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49
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429
Posted : Feb 4, 2011 01:39
lol.
honestly, freedom of religion is cool. so is freedom to lol.
lol.
Dance, even if you have nowhere to do it but your living room. ~Kurt Vonnegut
www.soundcloud.com/mixyott
Trevon
Started Topics :
6
Posts :
376
Posted : Feb 4, 2011 02:31
in this video, interesting trippy sounds (at least to me):
(0:48 to 1:16)
(1:35 to 2:45) 303
Mike A
Subra
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185
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3954
Posted : Feb 4, 2011 12:35
Quote:
On 2011-02-03 19:15, aciduss wrote:
I like stuff that is hard to believe and difficult to digest by the logical analytical mind.
It challenges paradigms and that is one of the effects i love of the psychedelic experience on myself.
You know, take 2000 years back. No one could see the earth as a whole. Some thought it was a sphere, some thought it was flat. Common knowledge is that it was flat, but then some smart Greeks figured out it was round after all. It challenged paradigms, some people told them they are full of shit but it was true because it was proofable using science (or the notion of science in the ancient world).
On the other hand, some people believe pink elephants fly and they challenge the paradigm that elephants are land based and usually are grey. But no matter what you do - that's not true.
Quote:
I know it can be exhausting when swimming against current and just trying to explain stuff that is hardly being explored by traditional science.
It is also easy to fall into blind beliefs and foolish thoughts but, even though your ideas are a little confusing for some of us I think you have very noticeable energy on them and that gives them enough weight for me, at least to take them in consideration before rejecting concepts that are weird and contrasting with most here on isratrance.
Define "energy" for me please.
Quote:
Psytrance is a sonic sacrament, a way to trance the mind into The One.
Quote:
PS. DH & Mike: you project so much rage to Moki's way of seeing life just because you can't see it the same way.
Not rage, just reasonable questioning.
You see, I am a real scientist (starting my real Ph.D project next year) and one of the things we do, is question everything. Someone said, "extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof". All I see is claims without proofs. If Moki gives proper proof, I'll be more than happy to accept it. But so far, all I see is pseudoscientifical and bizarre metaphysical mumbling.
Pavel
Troll
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313
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8649
Posted : Feb 4, 2011 15:37
Moki, never let the truth ruin your very cool story.
Everyone in the world is doing something without me
aciduss
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 4, 2011 16:59
Mike, I understand your points here... what i don't understand is the lack of respect and rudeness you charge your words with.
I can notice you are a passionate person towards science and you have been taught to question everything, that is very good, but why do you have to completely bash other people idea's just because they are not rational under the light of formal science?
In fact, in most of the threads I see your posts I can notice a "better than thou" attitude that is not what, i believe, works the best for healthy discussion.
No mater how stupid or non grounded Moki's ideas may appear to you I think you can show a little more respect and a warmer attitude.
I really don't like the thread going this way now... why don't you better contribute to the original topic? What do you do to make your music psychedelic in nature? Instead of trying to impose a scientific pov on other people maybe you should practice sharing your own experience on the subject.
I find it really hard to believe that psychedelic trance producers act this way... haven't you been there under a decent dose trying to figure out stuff that science has left behind? Also, as long as i know formal psychedelic research was just retaken few years ago... there is so much to learn from mind, consciousness, drugs, sound, etc.
Hope you go well in your phd, peace and good vibes brotha.
Pavel, do you even make music? Glad to have the forum's clown around.
Cheers.
mk47
Inactive User
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118
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Posted : Feb 4, 2011 17:16
loki
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
49
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429
Posted : Feb 4, 2011 18:04
Quote:
I find it really hard to believe that psychedelic trance producers act this way... haven't you been there under a decent dose trying to figure out stuff that science has left behind? Also, as long as i know formal psychedelic research was just retaken few years ago... there is so much to learn from mind, consciousness, drugs, sound, etc.
aciduss, taking life too seriously is never a good thing, but taking your passion at least somewhat seriously is a VERY good thing. consider that DH, mike, and whoever else, takes music a little, healthy bit seriously - and that claims about as ridiculous as "pink elephants fly" or "cosmic octave" can be a bit insulting or offensive even.
it's like homeopathy, really... the argument used by homeopaths is "well, western science isn't always right, they have so much money invested in medicine they want you to think it's the only way, they aren't open to any alternatives so fuck them..." uhm, no. homeopathy is an insult to folk who have genuinely dedicated their lives to help and heal people.
jerry garcia once wrote that the fan mail that disturbed him most were tales of acid-induced "psychic connections" emanating from the band while performing - signs that some deadheads had totally gone off the rocker. i don't think it's because garcia was a close-minded bigot, just a generally concerned chiller with a passion for music.
i personally don't care - live and let live, and i will generally laugh at pseudoscience and its followers.
as for this thread... it was hijacked, yeah, but thankfully this is not the last time this thread will appear so Dance, even if you have nowhere to do it but your living room. ~Kurt Vonnegut
www.soundcloud.com/mixyott
Mike A
Subra
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185
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3954
Posted : Feb 4, 2011 18:21
Quote:
On 2011-02-04 16:59, aciduss wrote:
Mike, I understand your points here... what i don't understand is the lack of respect and rudeness you charge your words with.
Show me rudeness. I just reread all of my posts in this thread and the only thing I saw was "wtf" which is legitimate, and that dog pissing example which I find hilarious, not rude.
Quote:
why do you have to completely bash other people idea's just because they are not rational under the light of formal science?
Because it's not rational under the light of formal science.
Quote:
In fact, in most of the threads I see your posts I can notice a "better than thou" attitude that is not what, i believe, works the best for healthy discussion.
Show me please, this is totally not what I meant and I'll see what you're talking about then I will try to do better next time.
Quote:
No mater how stupid or non grounded Moki's ideas may appear to you I think you can show a little more respect and a warmer attitude.
You want me to write what? "I love you and you're so nice but I still think your theory is wrong"?
Quote:
why don't you better contribute to the original topic? What do you do to make your music psychedelic in nature?
Ok. I use scales which are not the usual major/minor scales. I make extensive use of automation on various parameters in my sounds (not just the usual filter sweep). I do not use the 33th octave of Earth's resonant frequency.
I would add to this discussion the placebo effect. An example would be some charlatans sell preety quartz crystals, claiming it has a mystic energy and will help you find work/love/money/whatever. Obviously, there is no mystic energy inside the crystal. But the gullible people who buy this, actually believe in it - causing their self confidence to increase, thus helping them actually find their one love or a new job.
I can see how this applies to Moki's cosmic octave as well. Music is played at some gig, and then the DJ tells the drugged up raver that the music has the cosmic octave in it, so the raver gets all happy and goes "wow!! amazing!!" and his lsd or peyote or whatever trip intensifies. So yes, the "cosmic octave" did make him trip better, but not because of any real reason.
aciduss
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 4, 2011 19:06
Perhaps you just have a strong way of expressing yourself... thanks for your comments.
TimeTraveller
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 4, 2011 20:10
I think it is good to many people to get the awareness in 100% that this cosmic octave is one long waste of time in connection with making music.Keep this cosmic octave for esotericists ,they can philosophize endless about it and save your time to design some honest music.
This can save a lot of time and give space for usefull education.
For topics about pink elephants or some magic there is enough of space in the spirituality subforum.
I like this forum too.
What is important to design psychedelic music is knowledge of spectrum(soundcolours based on our 20hz-20khz spectrum),music theory (harmony,cadences maybe,some scales and known moods) and things like that,the last few pages were clearifying and amusing but also nothing else than offtopic.
And ignorance can also be rude.
aciduss
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 4, 2011 20:27
Apologies if my ignorance appears rude to you. I seek only to learn and develop my music and sound design skills from more experienced peers here at this board.
It is just that creating really new and innovative ideas seems like a pretty hard task, revolves between inspiration, knowledge and true discoveries.
To improve my music and make it appealing to the psychedelic dancer is my sometimes too high aim when one has to look into improbable places to freshen up the brain.
Music is art after all... not science, although it has a lot do with it.
Mike A
Subra
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185
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Posted : Feb 4, 2011 20:38
If you want to make your music better, buy better monitors, learn music theory, explore further your synths, and work work work. Don't expect to find magic frequencies and cosmic octaves, because they do not work in music.
Good luck!
TimeTraveller
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 4, 2011 20:45
Aciduss I was not mentioning you with my last sentence about ignorance.
And actually music is science too,the biggest composer of music history were revealled later as great mathematicians.For instane what Bach did was playing with all variations of logic based on mathemtics.It is all explainable.
And you can also study music science, I wanted it before I decided for another way.
One of those spirits that impressed me the most in real life was a music scientist.
https://soundcloud.com/shivagarden
