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Dear Artist, how many copies of your album were sold?
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Paulo
Started Topics :
6
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43
Posted : Sep 3, 2008 17:28
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you miss an important point, underground = less money = no future.
artists spend 24/7 every year all the year on their music (at least the real artists), therefor they need to get more apreciation to what they do in order to keep doing it.
underground is ok for young artists with less experience, but evetually the artists feel that they need to grow something bigger, otherwise they won't be able to feed their families in the future, if they will be able to have a family at all.
I'm sure that non of the artists want to find themself at the age of 50+- sitting in their studio alone with no money and no friends and families...
most of us (the fans) won't be there to support them when they get old, they need to think about their future.
however, if they go mainstream and do it only for the money with boring music, copy others and create boring formulas, evetually they will hate themself and lose everything.
making music for underground parties isn't a way of life...it is a good start, but you can't stay underground.
they need to go mainstream, but with their own style, otherwise THEY FAIL.
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IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
65
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1707
Posted : Sep 4, 2008 18:24
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^^totally agree, and maybe some of them should consider moving to other genres.
 "The dedication to repetition — the search for nirvana in a single held tone or an endlessly cycling rhythm — is one of electronic music's noblest gestures." |
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Basilisk
IsraTrance Full Member
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168
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2984
Posted : Sep 4, 2008 21:55
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On 2008-09-02 22:44, The Chilling Spirit wrote:
You might be interested in this great talk:
How Piracy Feeds a Starving Audience by Michael Perkins
This talk will present observations of the relationship between technology and art in a comprehensive look at how the rise of piracy and its effect on the music industry can enrich the art form as well as the global audience. Drawing from the ideology of open source and user-supported technology, this talk will attempt to demonstrate that the concept of "free music" is set to overhaul the way in which music is created and acquired. The topics to be discussed include the history of the music industry, the war with the RIAA, Digital Rights Management, Creative Commons, and more.
http://www.thelasthope.org/media/audio/64kbps/How_Piracy_Feeds_a_Starving_Audience.mp3
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Thanks for the find! I posted the video and a small response on my site:
http://www.ektoplazm.com/videos/how-piracy-feeds-a-starving-audience/
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thegooddale
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
26
Posts :
626
Posted : Sep 5, 2008 23:08
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In the age of downloading, underground labels need to raise the bar.
Substance.
The typical psy releases packaging for the most part is so drab and uninteresting. This is supposed to be a psychedelic scene, give the fans something to sink their teeth into as far as packaging is concerned.
DIY Distribution.
This is a pretty heavily networked scene. In almost every other underground scene, the majority of album sales come from purchases at live shows. Psytrance labels should work on this. Our friend Roberto from Mantra Sounds runs a booth at our parties where he stocks a few labels. He has a small selection and still manages to sell a dozen or so cds @ a 150 person party. We'll see how he does for the bigger festival next weekend. I think this is absolutely the avenue that if taken properly could up sales exponentially. |
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ocelot
ocelot
Started Topics :
94
Posts :
783
Posted : Sep 6, 2008 21:40
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sales require channels
psytrance and other underground music is not available in the traditional widespread network (music network of big labels like sony/bmg, virgin/atlantic, etc...being able to buy it in all the big boring stores...)
usually you must go to speciality shops that mostly sell clothing now. in this aspect the 3 track new vinyl every week approach of techno, house, dnb, etc. labels exceeds psy in that dj's need musical food and must buy vinyl...
incidentally traditional music sales are down also because everyone rips music and doesnt go to the local mega-shopping center to get their music anymore...
new paradigms and new methods are needed across the board of all music industries. things are changing.
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overtonez
Started Topics :
2
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16
Posted : Sep 7, 2008 06:55
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Quote:
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On 2008-09-02 22:44, The Chilling Spirit wrote:
You might be interested in this great talk:
How Piracy Feeds a Starving Audience by Michael Perkins
This talk will present observations of the relationship between technology and art in a comprehensive look at how the rise of piracy and its effect on the music industry can enrich the art form as well as the global audience. Drawing from the ideology of open source and user-supported technology, this talk will attempt to demonstrate that the concept of "free music" is set to overhaul the way in which music is created and acquired. The topics to be discussed include the history of the music industry, the war with the RIAA, Digital Rights Management, Creative Commons, and more.
http://www.thelasthope.org/media/audio/64kbps/How_Piracy_Feeds_a_Starving_Audience.mp3
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brilliant video...dont like the way he slags lars ulrich, i like metallica! : )
quality and originality rules : )
believe in nothing, and you will find yourself.
www.myspace.com/tartinitones |
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overtonez
Started Topics :
2
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16
Posted : Sep 7, 2008 08:18
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the point i think is, that with technology today, you can do lots of your own promotion and get your music out there, without much cost to your own pocket. it doesnt cost very much to make music anyways these days...everything is on the computer.. and not really that much time! the question is making the choice between making recycled music to try and please the market or original music and influence it...either way, theres a chance of being successful without spending fortunes, which is great because you dont have to really depend on a label to get your music out there. if its good, it will spread anyways. thats the sort of playground the internet has created for us, i feel, which can be used to ones advantage.
the problem with music is in that it requires the process of creation, which will determine your worth in the market, unlike say doing your MBA from a very good college, which immediately earmarks your potential worth in the market, in terms of a job and salary. hence there is that gestation period, which can be incredibly long, to be able to make any money out of it. i think it is more than likely that one will always have to lead two lives, one in the commercial world and one in the studio world. as an artist it would, i think be very hard to justify not making music, simply because one is not getting enough out of it materialistically....people like to watch tv, go horse riding, play football...some people like making music : )
believe in nothing, and you will find yourself.
www.myspace.com/tartinitones |
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soulfood
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
10
Posts :
875
Posted : Sep 8, 2008 12:38
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Quote:
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On 2008-09-07 08:18, overtonez wrote:
people like to watch tv, go horse riding, play football...some people like making music : )
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To me this is pretty much where I'm at with making music and I'd be over the moon if I just get a few people to listen to my tracks if I manage to finish one. But I could understand someone whose made a living out of music for some 20 years getting a bit frustrated about a decline in profits as they have gotten used to a way of life that's now under threat. Move with the times I guess, but many people don't like that kind of change.
No skin off my nose though... but that just sounds selfish. |
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Pythagoraz
TimeDrained / Pythagoraz
Started Topics :
8
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337
Posted : Sep 8, 2008 20:04
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Our debut album "Dilemma" that was released November 2007 have sold less than 1000 copies.
In fact I do have more than a few artist friend who ever sold more than that.
I would agree that selling 500-1500 copies is normal for serious Progressive albums in general.
Live gigs is where the money is at as far as I can see. Due to the fact that you can have around2-3 gigs a week if you are succesful. Then considering that a gig normally pays equally or more than a track for a compilation, an artist's music production just can't keep up with that.
I am of course speaking on behalf of myself and other "less known" artists. I do believe bigger progressive names at for instance Iboga, Digital Structures etc. have a whole other view on this.
Anyway, no one starts doing this for the money unless they are delirious.
www.iono-music.com
www.myspace.com/timedrained |
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monno
Grapes Of Wrath
Started Topics :
9
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454
Posted : Oct 12, 2008 01:27
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In these high-speed internet (everything within hands reach) times, it´s a good idea to take stock of the situation.
while i think digital distribution is the way everything is headed, It does not exclude the label since proper mastering still costs money (and is hard to find among this ocean of semi, old half deaf veterans claiming to be up for the job)
Also quality control and a strong sense of musical direction needs to be excerted for any release to reach it´s full potential. This objectiveness a label can provide, whereas the individual artist might be slightly more subjective (and without experience) in matters involving the release process
Now on-topic:
A certain split album that involved yours truly released on parvati has almost sold all printed copies, if memory serves me right thats about 1500-2000 copies during the course of 4 years since it´s release on Parvarti records. don´t know any other numbers off the top of my head but usually such releases reach between 500-1000 copies over time.
So yeah i am still chasing the end of the rainbow for my pot of gold. I´ll have more luck planting money trees i think.
That being said, i still want the label i am affiliated with to survive and thrive because it to me is an island of sanity where i can unfold the products of my brain and studio in unison.
There is a considerably stronger potential for artists to make money from live bookings, letting their releases serve as a calling card, if compared to the money that can be had from a release. However only a few can actually feed a family let alone themselves from live gigs, and so other avenues must be sought in the long run.
The money is in cheesy commercial club music for kids parties, not in making psychedelic music for adult (hopefully) free thinking, open minded individuals.
sigh! facing the facts of reality, while willfully ignoring them at the same time  why? to keep doing what i love
Mastering available here:
http://www.bimmelim-soundlabs.com
http://soundcloud.com/onkeldunkel
http://www.myspace.com/onkeldunkelownz
http://www.parvati-records.com |
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leaetherstrip
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
59
Posted : Oct 14, 2008 05:43
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This post was started more than a year ago and 2008-09 will be a very interesting period for labels and the entire scene as whole! As we head into a global recession(if you are not already there) people simply wont have much money to go to parties and buy cds! So I think sales will drop even more which is good I think because it would clean the scene from this labels who dont really have the best interest and promote this copy paste artist like some previously said. It would be good to switch to digital distribution to eliminate garbage but once the quality is there wave quality that is but for now cds. |
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Basilisk
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
168
Posts :
2984
Posted : Nov 27, 2008 05:31
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Anyone else feel like coming forward?
I am particularly interested in the many digital EPs being released, sometimes exclusively, on Beatport. I wonder if sales are satisfactory for those involved.
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Elad
Tsabeat/Sattel Battle
Started Topics :
158
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5306
Posted : Nov 27, 2008 08:02
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moki
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
38
Posts :
1931
Posted : Nov 27, 2008 15:37
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WOW what a topic.
So guys, thanks a lot for supplying us with the freshest and not so freshest infos about your sells and about your figures. We are now very well informed about the trance market. But one thing I really like in this discussion and it was stated by Detox :
Quote:
| Every year things get even worst and if you ask me its a matter of very short time before everything collapses and the only labels that will survive are the very small ones that are happy releasing their label owners and friends music and satisfied with 400-500 sold copies which covers their manufacturing expenses. " |
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RIGHT! INDEED. So nice that you have seen it, even if it was just a sentence hidden between all the rest of the business perspectives and opportunities in the scene. The point is that even the media business world wide has already brought it straight to this conclusion. I am talking as someone who has studied also media management and really observed what is happening in the world out there and wrote the degree paper on Web 2.0 and Media, the new revolution in Media. It is a process that is called the Long Tail in the media buseness theory. It states that the only products that have a chance to survive nowadays are the products of the non main stream. And it is a theory that compares the music market with a fractal of smaller and smaller Sub Styles. And the point is that at the end of the day , it is the Long Tail that will survive, that means all those small products that have even less than 100 listeners, cause in the summe they make more profit than a big big product of a mainstream star. But i will stop by that, let me know if you wanna know more about this media management theory, then i will write more.
I have another thing to add.
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On 2007-08-14 02:44, DETOX wrote:
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On 2007-08-14 00:40, v.v2 wrote:
I am now thoroughly confused. Maybe I am oldworld. I have always thought the best way to support a psy artist is go for her/his party. I should buy their work too?
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In order for an artist to become well known and start getting some bookings there are some people that are named label managers who invest money on the artists in order to release their music and introduce them to the world and promote them and hopefully manage to sell well so that they can make a profit out of risking their money on a specific artist and his music.
Going to parties is indeed supporting the artists (and also their label if the label handles the bookings) but buying original music means supporting both the label and the artist.
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Oh really??? I mean come on. This what you say is not even slightly up to date. SOunds even boring. I mean, yes, i mostly support the artists mainly by going to their gigs and paying for that. But i didnt get the point why i should support the label as well. I mean it is definitely not the label that brings the music to my home. If you are not aware every child can nowadays have whatever music it wants. Just put the name in the search machine and it is right there. So i support a label only if i think it is doing a good job in promoting the artists that I Love. If it has nice mission statements, nice attitudes, nie philosophies, nice websites whatever. Otherwise i dont need to. I have the music also without them. YOu see??? I am not gonna be as idealistic as i was in the Money vs Trance topic, but you see the point i hope. And i dont have the impression about the labels that they are doing such a nice job for their artists. Some of them do and i support them fully.
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Braindrop
Braindrop
Started Topics :
140
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1730
Posted : Nov 28, 2008 06:39
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On 2008-11-27 08:02, Elad wrote:
btw how hard is it to make realese party for the artist and includ cd in the gate , there is 500 easy sold cds  maybe not full price but also no saikosounds fee
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Well... not difficult at all... when world over psytrance parties are being cracked!
www.braindrop.in |
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