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blatantly faking their "live set"
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konvndrvm
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
33
Posts :
1398
Posted : Dec 19, 2008 02:58
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*keeps it locked on the spacebar*
solution: just hide the dj all together
konvndrvm
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bastardsamadhi
Started Topics :
9
Posts :
437
Posted : Dec 19, 2008 03:10
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konflux
Konflux
Started Topics :
25
Posts :
811
Posted : Dec 19, 2008 03:24
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come on guys, don't take all the fun out of DJing. i mean it's quite boring ego-tripping there behind the CDJs as it is, and if you go ahead and plan everything out and not leave room for [pleasant] surprises it defeats the purpose altogether. for me anyway.
and as kri pointed out, if you rock, you don't need to worry about any of that. just keep on rocking.
nuff said.
 myspace.com/konfluxpsy | www.konfluxmusic.net | PsyTribe | Phar Psyde Recs. | Logical Light Recs.
For CD releases:
http://www.saikosounds.com/english/search.asp?search_str=konflux |
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DiMiTry
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
70
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2299
Posted : Dec 19, 2008 05:09
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winging it is fun, but you do have to know the music you're playing and have a decent ear for key.
..it's just another party.. |
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Ascension
IsraTrance Full Member
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170
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3642
Posted : Dec 19, 2008 05:49
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bluespectralmonkey
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
80
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1336
Posted : Dec 19, 2008 06:10
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i guess what i was saying in reference to making notes on a set,
is that you should just make notes to every track and then you can string together a set on the fly more easily. just a larger scale of organization.
mark the cue points for each track you like for posterity, not just for the set youre playing this weekend.
i see a lot of djs play with no notes at all, and wonder how they keep it all in check, or not.
i have like thousands of cds, so some way of keeping track is needed. cause every day i lose a marble.
www.bluespectralmonkey.com
www.touchsamadhi.com
www.interchill.com
www.metacrew.com
www.nw-psy.com |
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bluespectralmonkey
IsraTrance Full Member
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80
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1336
Posted : Dec 19, 2008 10:16
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GhregOnEarth
Phosphene
Started Topics :
30
Posts :
205
Posted : Dec 19, 2008 13:54
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Been on lurk mode on this topic for awhile. It's a good one and worthy of poi dog pondering. As it goes, this is just one mans perspective on this topic so ymmv....(clears throat) Generally, It seems good to try as much as possible to put myself in the shoes (hopefully) stomping some dust on the dancefloor.
On the one hand I think that it is really important to have some quality of liveness to the live set (else you just get set, who was an egyptian god and a rather malcontent one at that). I generally measure this on a scale of how much manual dexterity/chances of fuc'kedupedness (tm) there. Playing off a laptop is no where near the scale of chances of fucking up playing a guitar or djembe (we have probably all experienced the fuc'kedupedness of the djembe at some point at some party, in time [yes, I mean you hippy guy in the corner]). For my part, I do what I can to summon the muses of chance to splay their wings with controllers, samples, on the fly synths, microscopic fx, etc; etc;
On the other hand, as Mubali pointed out, it is really about the music and no one is going expecting that someone is to bust out with the solo from Don't Fear the Reaper behind the decks. So, as it goes, tt seems like a good idea to keep those booties shaking (big and skinny alike)....by extension an artist performing live outta really make sure there is some scaffolding in place to make sure things don't completely fall apart and the 303s keep a squelching, the drums keep a pounding and the birds keep a chirping....
From what I have seen the more talented artists out there try to strike that balance in their own unique way. And those are the ones I enjoy seeing.....Texas Faggott come to mind....Underworld and X-Dream also.
I've always wanted to incorporate a Theremin into my liveset. Unfortunately, organizers have a heard enough time providing my rather modest equipment rider, so I'm not sure if this will happen anytime soon. Love the sound of the Theremin though. Hopefully someone will program one for the iTouch soon.
Another thing that has always been exciting for me when I go see an artist is to hear familar tracks in a different context. Most of the released material that makes it into my livesets is remixed, sliced up and/or rearranged a bit (there is probably enough remixes of Sigilweaver material for remix album or two). I like to add some extra layers. It's a nice treat for the people who know the music, and..... well, gosh willarkers it keeps the music fresh for me too.
Honestly, I get a nice birds-eye view of a lot artists playing these days and I would say that a good 60-70% of them are just pushing play in one form or another. From one perspective this, of course, could be quite disheartening (especially for someone who handcrafts each liveset with love and sweat and pixels!), but it is really more mystifying than anything else for me. After nearly 20 years behind the decks I just cannot fathom standing up there doing nothing but twiddling my thumbs..... Might as well be standing in line at the supermarket (shaking ones ass at the supermarket, j-lo tabloid fuc'kers).
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distantcontact
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
79
Posted : Dec 19, 2008 19:46
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Great post Ghreg - it made my morning...you have a distinct (comical) voice within your writing. anyhoo I have also been on lurk mode on this topic, its certainly one to chew on - as it wont depart from the top topic...more what exactly constitutes a good live set rather than whats live vs. whats fake...
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On 2008-12-19 13:54, GhregOnEarth wrote:
tt seems like a good idea to keep those booties shaking (big and skinny alike)
Another thing that has always been exciting for me when I go see an artist is to hear familar tracks in a different context. Most of the released material that makes it into my livesets is remixed, sliced up and/or rearranged a bit (there is probably enough remixes of Sigilweaver material for remix album or two). I like to add some extra layers. It's a nice treat for the people who know the music, and..... well, gosh willarkers it keeps the music fresh for me too.
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Ghreg mad a buncha good points. One that I was going to touch on when I got around to gathering my thoughts into a cohesive post....
Hearing familiar tracks at a party is almost as delightful as hearing unreleased music for mwa. But I need balance between familiarity, originality, creativity, novelty, overall groove, etc. to denote a live set as better than a C. The most pleasurable sonic experience at a party happens when I am listening to remixes / modified tracks during a live/dj sets. EG from my most recent party, I believe Ghreg on Earth played a sick version of solstinox that sounded nothing like the track that comes out of my speakers and it was fucking awesome to rock out to. If I am able to visually process an artist modifying a familiar track this is ideal. Of course, this doesn't happen very often but it is a real treat.
The marvel of the artist's demonstration of his or her skills on stage is one aspect of what makes live music enjoyable for me. All this nonesense about hiding the artist/dj (which I am sure 90% of egotistical artist and djs would object to) is silliness.
The visual element is vital to the "live" (just meaning someone preforming infront of your face) performance as it enhances sensory experience in conjunction with the sound. I enjoy listening and djing music which is why I do this on my own time. However, when I go to see artist xyz play I would actually like to see artist xyz to place an image with the sounds i have come to enjoy. And I want to see xyz enthusiastic about their performance and dictating the dancefloor. Artists may not fancy being the center of attention all of the time during their live performance but the fact is that the reason youre standing up there is we the people enjoy your art thus have a natural appreciation and admiration for your craft and therefore are idolizing you in some way. This goes for artist, djs, promoters, and joe the plumber...This isn't elevator music its the focal aspect of the party.
I believe figuring out how to play tracks for performance is an entirely separate process tahn recording them...
I have seen a number of fake sets from birds eye view also, and am bewildered by this. I am sure this will evoke much less of a response but, what would motivate an aritst to check his email or jsut stand there rather than play live? Laziness, burned out from traveling, promoters pay, what does it?? I really thought it would be the opposite being that the more you play the more you become familiar with your material and the more improvisation you can incorporate. I have spoken to some artists who have told me they have develop new ideas for new combinatinos and tracks during their improvised live, which seems logical...
and the theremin idea is brilliant for innovative live performances..and concurred about the awesome timbre of the instrument...
Well enough of my rant. It's splendid that so many artists are contributing to this thread while adding credibility to it. |
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Colin OOOD
OOOD/Voice of Cod
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Dec 22, 2008 15:39
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$0.02
Seems to me that one reason why fake live sets have become so prevalent is that people have got the impression that to do a set that doesn't devalue the word 'live', you have to either play every single part live, surround yourself with a full studio's-worth of kit, or be some kind of genius musician. None of these is the case. In my humble opinion, all that's necessary for music to be 'live' is for the performers on stage to be actively involved in its performance and/or creation. OF COURSE no-one has twenty pairs of hands. But we do have one pair, and if those hands are not involved in the real-time manipulation of the sounds being heard then by definition the music being played is pre-recorded, not live. It doesn't even matter if most of the track is pre-recorded, as long as you're actually doing something live to contribute to it, whether that's live arrangement, playing percussion on a pad or glitching out a pre-recorded lead riff. A combination of all the above, spread out through the whole set? Fantastic! Just do stuff the audience can hear - the more the better - and you're playing live.
Secondly, the kit issue. Sure it's nice to be surrounded by a studio's-worth of equipment on stage; this is exactly how OOOD used to perform before about 2000 when our studio consisted of samplers, hardware synths (mainly monophonic analog), FX units and a mixer: one off Cubase (pre-VST, no audio recording), one off DAT + set the rig up for the next live one, repeat until done... but it's not necessary any more now that you can fit an entire studio inside a laptop. All you need is a MIDI controller or two and a bit of preparation. You don't even need an audio mixer - everything can be done in the box. The 'don't want to take lots of expensive kit on a plane' argument is totally specious; whilst you can take more kit if you want, you can fit everything you need for a killer live set inside a carry-on laptop bag.
Finally the 'musician' problem. Don't let anyone tell you any different - if the artist has the skills to make the music in the first place they have the skills to perform it with some degree of live interaction. You can't play keyboards? Fine, control the arrangement and work the FX, tweak a filter or two. Keyboard maestro? Perform using a stripped-down version of the entire track and play those leads in real-time, or add new and complementary material to a completed track. Guitarist? Well... hmm... be careful 
THERE REALLY IS NO EXCUSE for not playing live if that's how you've been billing yourself - however there are explanations. On the artist side these include laziness and the greedy desire to earn more cash without putting in the effort. On the promoters side it's the need to ensure a full venue and a lack of education or care about whether or not what they're advertising is what they'll actually deliver. Sure, some partygoers don't give a shit whether it's live or not; they're therefore out of the equation. Some (many?) peope do though, and those people deserve every bit of effort, inspiration and risk-taking we performers can give them.
And personally speaking, I couldn't look myself in the mirror in the morning if I knew I was going out there that night to lie to the people paying my rent and utility bills.
OOOD and Voice of Cod both have new albums out now and are available for booking in the US for Spring/Summer 2009. Contact Theo @ 28thday to discuss dates and flight-shares.
Mastering - http://mastering.OOOD.net :: www.is.gd/mastering
OOOD 5th album 'You Think You Are' - www.is.gd/tobuyoood :: www.OOOD.net
www.facebook.com/OOOD.music :: www.soundcloud.com/oood
Contact for bookings/mastering - colin@oood.net |
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thegooddale
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
26
Posts :
626
Posted : Dec 22, 2008 19:58
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Quote:
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On 2008-12-22 15:39, Colin OOOD wrote:
It doesn't even matter if most of the track is pre-recorded, as long as you're actually doing something live to contribute to it, whether that's live arrangement, playing percussion on a pad or glitching out a pre-recorded lead riff. A combination of all the above, spread out through the whole set? Fantastic! Just do stuff the audience can hear - the more the better - and you're playing live.
Secondly, the kit issue. Sure it's nice to be surrounded by a studio's-worth of equipment on stage; this is exactly how OOOD used to perform before about 2000 when our studio consisted of samplers, hardware synths (mainly monophonic analog), FX units and a mixer: one off Cubase (pre-VST, no audio recording), one off DAT + set the rig up for the next live one, repeat until done... but it's not necessary any more now that you can fit an entire studio inside a laptop. All you need is a MIDI controller or two and a bit of preparation. You don't even need an audio mixer - everything can be done in the box. The 'don't want to take lots of expensive kit on a plane' argument is totally specious; whilst you can take more kit if you want, you can fit everything you need for a killer live set inside a carry-on laptop bag.
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From a spectators stand point, it is not very fun to watch a guy duck down to play with a laptop for a while, then move to a midi controller to play a lead or some pads here and there.
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Axis Mundi
Axis Mundi
Started Topics :
75
Posts :
1848
Posted : Dec 22, 2008 23:51
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bastardsamadhi
Started Topics :
9
Posts :
437
Posted : Dec 23, 2008 01:12
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they are -- but the only cons are the price and the need for wall-wart (no USB power) -- er, though i just looked... they can run on batteries 
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koalakube
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
48
Posts :
437
Posted : Dec 23, 2008 05:35
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I own few faderfox products.
Very reliable and stable,small size (even tho slightly heavier than competitors).Reccomended.
Faderfox has been among the 1st putting out controllers dedicated to Ableton. |
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Colin OOOD
OOOD/Voice of Cod
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Dec 23, 2008 15:31
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Quote:
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From a spectators stand point, it is not very fun to watch a guy duck down to play with a laptop for a while, then move to a midi controller to play a lead or some pads here and there.
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I disagree. If it wasn't fun to watch someone "duck down to play with a laptop for a while, then move to a midi controller to play a lead or some pads here and there", then li(v)e acts like those on http://www.deadact.com wouldn't all be pretending to do just that.
The best performers are those who can give a bit of a show at the same time as playing their music. It's not easy but it's all part of being a performing musician, and this is surely proved by the amount of people who try and fool us into believing they're doing just that whilst in reality they have no real-time connection with what the dancefloor is hearing.
Faderfox rox btw. Mastering - http://mastering.OOOD.net :: www.is.gd/mastering
OOOD 5th album 'You Think You Are' - www.is.gd/tobuyoood :: www.OOOD.net
www.facebook.com/OOOD.music :: www.soundcloud.com/oood
Contact for bookings/mastering - colin@oood.net |
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