scobbah
Kiriyama
Started Topics :
35
Posts :
991
Posted : Dec 16, 2008 19:13
Maybe I was vague, but I don't mean to come down on those who praise their favourite artists. What I wish to emphasise is the importance not to treat the artist like a rockstar, because it may in fact lead to him or her ending up like one. Do you know what I mean? I've been in blissful states of profound satisfaction because an artist/DJ has helped me to get there... Certainly, I have expressed my appreciation afterwards but that doesn't have to mean that I put the artist on a pedestal. I do remember that he or she is of equal worth and that the tribe, including the artist, helped shape the experience during his or her set. It is not as though by divine support the artist shaped the tribe's experience all by himself. It takes two to tango, and it takes a great many to psychedelically rock out! (oh cliché! someone shoot me please...)
Aural transmissions from the deep forests of Sweden www.dvsmrecords.org - 'Patterns II EP' by Silent Horror out now!
Ascension
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
170
Posts :
3642
Posted : Dec 16, 2008 20:28
I get what you're saying. Everyone get together and prevent another Skazi from being born!! It was our faults! Just teasin
It's weird that you mention that since this morning I looked at some pictures of an artist I'm friends with on myspace recently posted. They were playing on this huge stage and the crowd was separated by a metal fence. I was thinking the whole time, that doesn't seem like it was that fun of a party despite the fact that thousands of people were there. There was such a separation between stage and people. Then again, it was Brazil (not dissing Brazil, but that's how people from there say the parties are)...
http://soundcloud.com/ascensionsound www.chilluminati.org - Midwest based psytrance group
Hidroponik
Arahat
Started Topics :
27
Posts :
1075
Posted : Dec 16, 2008 23:14
Quote:
On 2008-12-16 16:21, Ascension wrote:
a neat idea would be to have a completely circular setup with the dj booth in the middle. Run like a 6 point surround sound setup with the dj booth in the exact center and the dancefloor would form all around it. It would be really interesting to see how people react to it.
Unfortunately, this does not work so well. You have the problem of monitoring a cue track as a DJ. We tried this once in the desert of So. California about 6 years ago. I could not get tracks to sync up because there were 6 kick drums coming at you from 6 different angles, and the spacing between the booth and speakers facing inwards (the dancefloor) was too far away which caused about a 1/2 second delay between what you play and what you heard.
You need some serious sound rigging and a completely isolated sound-proof dj booth so the artist can accurately beat-match with the monitors in the booth. There was too much PA-System volume in the dj's area which drowned out what was being cued up.
Hidroponik
Arahat
Started Topics :
27
Posts :
1075
Posted : Dec 16, 2008 23:17
Check out the old thread here for an event that was put on by Squee and the Oregon families called, Slammo!!
We did a live set with 7 of us artists and our laptops, all linked up through midi.
none of us had ever performed or written music together, but we managed to create a 10 hour improvisational psy-trance live set. Basically, each person threw 2 or 3 sounds into the mix so in essence, there was anywhere from 10-20 loops going at once over the PA-System to create brand new material.
sometimes it flowed, sometimes it didn't, but it was definitely all Live and a ton of fun to feed off the fellow musicians and create new things on the fly to drop into the next sequence.
It can be done people, but very rarely with just one person or even one computer.
Anybody remember the mainstream artist BT? He did a tour a few years ago called "The Laptop Symphony". He brought about 4 or 5 mac's with him and did his live set by himself.
This was a really close re-enactment to his studio work (never saw it first hand, but read reviews from friends).
He was able to do it himself by having one machine as a dedicated sequencer (just like the analog step sequencers of yore) and the rest were for sounds, beats, effects, etc etc.
the point being is that he did it himself, but at the cost of $12000 for laptops, maybe $1000 for flight cases, probably a few hundred for cables, then maybe a couple grand for sound cards.
kahn
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
99
Posts :
786
Posted : Dec 16, 2008 23:22
Quote:
On 2008-12-16 23:14, Hidroponik wrote:
Quote:
On 2008-12-16 16:21, Ascension wrote:
a neat idea would be to have a completely circular setup with the dj booth in the middle. Run like a 6 point surround sound setup with the dj booth in the exact center and the dancefloor would form all around it. It would be really interesting to see how people react to it.
Unfortunately, this does not work so well. You have the problem of monitoring a cue track as a DJ. We tried this once in the desert of So. California about 6 years ago. I could not get tracks to sync up because there were 6 kick drums coming at you from 6 different angles, and the spacing between the booth and speakers facing inwards (the dancefloor) was too far away which caused about a 1/2 second delay between what you play and what you heard.
You need some serious sound rigging and a completely isolated sound-proof dj booth so the artist can accurately beat-match with the monitors in the booth. There was too much PA-System volume in the dj's area which drowned out what was being cued up.
of course, if you hire all laptop dj's and maybe a few pre-arranged live artists, this would become a moot point as beatmatching does not exist in these scenarios, haha!
I could definitely see the problem that it would be TOO LOUD in the center for the DJ to concentrate, beatmatch, etc.. But honestly, I don't think it's impossible. I think it could still be done accurately (especially if you're monitoring on headphones). The problem is, you probably wouldn't be able to hear very well by the end of the night. Not sure if it counts, but Armin Van Buuren is doing JUST THIS (DJing in the center of the room) at Together as One this year.
http://www.soundcloud.com/djKAHN
kameleonpangea36
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
77
Posts :
537
Posted : Dec 17, 2008 00:45
and what about Rabbit in the Moon? I have no idea what Confucius is doing back there but its a damn entertaining show! maybe we all just need someone like Bunny:)
paradigm
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
54
Posts :
1098
Posted : Dec 18, 2008 00:34
Re: set lists... touchy subject. While any DJ worth their salt should be able to read a crowd know their tracks and be able to adjust on the fly....
those of us who are above the standard par on mixing, and actually relish the showman ship and quality and trick mixing sometimes need those little pointers.
take some of the greatest mixers and djs in world.
Both Qbert and Mix Master Mike play with set lists, with everything from que points, to key to timber wrote out.
Now granted that not psy trance, but some of the best mixing and trickery requires homework.
Laptop mixing.... ehh wrong. Do not pass go, do not collect $200. The crew i set up in the midwest weas founding on a premise of no laptops allowed. Yes i realize one can do many things from different sources on it. Whatever. Im old school
"Mirrors reflecting Mirrors, what kind of sorcery is this"
As for the circular set up..... I highly doubt Armin Van Burnen is playing with out monitors and using the room to work off. They did that same set up at Boom 2004, and it was atrocious.
Logical Light Music - SF
Straylight Productions -SF
Sound/Mind - Denver
Xcience - Midwest
labyrinth
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
37
Posts :
275
Posted : Dec 18, 2008 00:42
Quote:
On 2008-12-16 23:17, Hidroponik wrote:
We did a live set with 7 of us artists and our laptops, all linked up through midi.
that would be one way to do it, a trance band, why not. different people can control and play different elements for each track. let's change it!
and yeah, will never forget seeing Rabbit in the Moon back in the day, we could definitely use some more 'Bunny' like characters. and more of these firedancers
thegooddale
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
26
Posts :
626
Posted : Dec 18, 2008 01:12
Quote:
On 2008-12-16 19:13, scobbah wrote:
Maybe I was vague, but I don't mean to come down on those who praise their favourite artists. What I wish to emphasise is the importance not to treat the artist like a rockstar, because it may in fact lead to him or her ending up like one. Do you know what I mean? I've been in blissful states of profound satisfaction because an artist/DJ has helped me to get there... Certainly, I have expressed my appreciation afterwards but that doesn't have to mean that I put the artist on a pedestal. I do remember that he or she is of equal worth and that the tribe, including the artist, helped shape the experience during his or her set. It is not as though by divine support the artist shaped the tribe's experience all by himself. It takes two to tango, and it takes a great many to psychedelically rock out! (oh cliché! someone shoot me please...)
I guess I will put a call in to cancel the package of hookers and blow we had ordered for you when you arrive here in February.
DiMiTry
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
70
Posts :
2299
Posted : Dec 18, 2008 01:15
Quote:
On 2008-12-18 00:34, paradigm wrote:
Laptop mixing.... ehh wrong. Do not pass go, do not collect $200. The crew i set up in the midwest weas founding on a premise of no laptops allowed. Yes i realize one can do many things from different sources on it. Whatever. Im old school
"Mirrors reflecting Mirrors, what kind of sorcery is this"
umm, CDs aren't old school. Vinyl, dats maybe. And weren't there people just a few years ago who were saying that CD DJs are fakes? lol.
..it's just another party..
thegooddale
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
26
Posts :
626
Posted : Dec 18, 2008 01:18
Quote:
On 2008-12-16 23:17, Hidroponik wrote:
I think he was getting around $10,000 a show for this. To me, he is the epitome of being a douchebag rockstar, but goddam the guy is brilliant and extremely talented to pull this type of thing off.
No, he was getting 10,000 dollars to bring 2,500 to 4,000 people to a venue and make a promoter a bunch of money. It's a business, you get what you can bring in, this is the reason why BT doesn't get paid that same 10k any longer, or plays once in a blue moon.
paradigm
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
54
Posts :
1098
Posted : Dec 18, 2008 05:25
@ Dimitri very true, poor choice of words on my part, i was just looking for a setup to my futurama quote
Logical Light Music - SF
Straylight Productions -SF
Sound/Mind - Denver
Xcience - Midwest
.:DRAGON:.
Dragon
Started Topics :
18
Posts :
432
Posted : Dec 18, 2008 19:42
RE : Set lists , notes
[ my $0.02 ]
I can mix on the fly all day long, pulling tracks to play and keeping a good flow etc .. but most of the nite-time tunes I get into aren't written in full measures and standard "format" ( ie: both tracks breaking and crashing at the same time in the mix ), so I usually choose compile a set ahead of time for that time slot, dissect each mix from the transition point backwards to give me my cue point ( which usually is some random spot in the current track that I would never be able to remember for each mix of a 1.5 -2 hr set )
Thus, I make a list of tracks and cues to ensure the mix comes out of the speakers as smooth as possible, not just "a good set" .. Don't get me wrong though, there have been plenty of occasions where I've tossed the planned set right before I went on because it wasn't right for that time and started a fresh set on the fly ( i usually say "pulled out of my ass" lol).. I guess I just prefer the accuracy that I can get from a few notes, in which you still have to perform all the normal dj functions for mixing, just getting a little help with those random "preferred" cue points.
I would surely hope that this doesn't make me any less of a "dj" though .. and for what it's worth, I'll spend about 4 hours doing my "homework" for every hour of slot time .. (2 hr slot = roughly 8 hours of prep time) It's definitely not easier and you really need to have an understanding of the party's intended flow of music if you plan your sets ..
As far as future sets go, I'll be glad to improvise my sets for anyone who doesn't want me using notes LOL ..
( and a shameless plug >> my debut album releases on Jan 23rd, titled "in.formation" - can be picked up at psyshop.com or saikosounds.com etc .. )
Much love to the US Psy-Scene and thanks for all the support you guys have given me over the years ~
cheers,
D.
New Album : Spirals of Time : Now Available !
www.nodatagency.com/artists/dragon/
krisamadhi
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
114
Posts :
546
Posted : Dec 18, 2008 23:49
bluespectralmonkey
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
80
Posts :
1336
Posted : Dec 19, 2008 00:11
ive always been a strong proponent of the method i use.
elaborate notes for each track making sure you know which ones are good to pull out, including stylistic notes, samples of note, bpms or other code to make sure you know which bombs are ready to go off.
i find this makes my whole collection more accessible and im able to glide through combinations of tracks that ive never tried simply because i know the music well enough to string it together in different ways.
sure , going on the fly figuring it out track by track can sometimes be stressful, but more often it seems to create for me a flowing experience of happy surprises!
www.bluespectralmonkey.com www.touchsamadhi.com www.interchill.com www.metacrew.com www.nw-psy.com
What I wish to emphasise is the importance not to treat the artist like a rockstar, because it may in fact lead to him or her ending up like one. Do you know what I mean? I've been in blissful states of profound satisfaction because an artist/DJ has helped me to get there... Certainly, I have expressed my appreciation afterwards but that doesn't have to mean that I put the artist on a pedestal. I do remember that he or she is of equal worth and that the tribe, including the artist, helped shape the experience during his or her set. It is not as though by divine support the artist shaped the tribe's experience all by himself. 
