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BE VERY CAREFULL WITH STARSOUNDS REC.
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DETOX
Moderator
Started Topics :
296
Posts :
6194
Posted : Aug 17, 2003 21:17
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Before you complain about 'bad labels' that dont pay you your money and bla bla bla bla make sure that you first read your contracts carefully and understand them well and then make your complaints in public.
In your contract dear NK (just like in everyone elses contract from the names that you mentioned) it says that you must FIRST provide the label with a valid invoice and then to receive your money.When you do that then everybody will be happy.And please speak for yourself and dont include other names like Triplex (we have got into touch with Ioannis and everything will be fixed up as soon as we get back from our vacation and will continue in good faith our collaboration) or like Virus who refuses to provide the label with those valid invoices that his contract mentions.
Remember each coin has two sides.
  Toodaloo Motherfuckers!!!!! |
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traveller
IsraTrance Senior Member
Started Topics :
234
Posts :
3803
Posted : Aug 17, 2003 22:55
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what's "valid invoice" ?
"The dinosaurs became extinct because they didn't have a space program."
- Larry Niven |
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NK
CyberTronic
Started Topics :
6
Posts :
206
Posted : Aug 17, 2003 22:55
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him we will see that...
with other we have spoken for the money...
i dont have provlem with u !
u know that!
good luck in Paros
see ya mr Mike
/// NameLess \ |
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NK
CyberTronic
Started Topics :
6
Posts :
206
Posted : Aug 17, 2003 23:59
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ask to Menog...
provide invoice label in Starsound when you get the 1500 euro (advance) ? 
/// NameLess \ |
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timsensient
Sensient
Started Topics :
101
Posts :
438
Posted : Aug 18, 2003 02:36
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Traveller...invoice is a document from the artist to the label that serves as a record that the label payed the artist, this is for the financial records of the label for tax purposes etc.
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traveller
IsraTrance Senior Member
Started Topics :
234
Posts :
3803
Posted : Aug 18, 2003 03:31
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shouldn't the label pay before they get the invoice?
"The dinosaurs became extinct because they didn't have a space program."
- Larry Niven |
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nobody4
Inactive User
Started Topics :
21
Posts :
358
Posted : Aug 18, 2003 09:41
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Hello all,
I've read this thread only till about 5'th page, if I repeat someones words, I apologise beforehand.
I would like to give some basic information for the ppl and new releasing aritsts about the licensing system:
The whole system of music licensing and release is a bit gray in the trance scene. true, contracts are signed, but hey, how can an independent artist from (lets say) Swizerland sue a record company from Brazil for not paying royalties? the sums in question are not even worth the flight ticket there, not to mention lawers...
some general info (for the public and future artists):
The Licensing system works so, that the label & artist sign a licensing contract (whether exclusive or not) that detail the payment method for the release: advance (if any) and royalties, which is money paid annualy, usualy first payment after 6 months and then quarterly (every 3-4 months, depends on the contract).
Advance is money paid BEFORE the release is made, and it is ON THE TAB money; means it's part of royalties payement: if advance is 200$, and after 6 months the artists share is 300$, then the artist get 100$ in the first annual payment (simple math).
One very important issue: the payment for the artist/s is done AFTER covering expences (for printing, cover art, distribution costs, publication etc'). This is very important, since it determines the amount of income for the release.
For compilations, the payment method is so: every publishing aritst get a precentage out of the total income of the CD (after expences coverage and label payment). for Artist album it is usualy 50%, but again, it depends on the contract.
Now back to our issue:
1. Trance compilation CD incomes are usualy so low, that paying expences and dividing the remaining share between 8-9 published tracks, the sum that is paid never coveres any advance. the advance almost always works for the artists, since they make more money out of it than royalties.
2. Many independent artists cannot produce an invoice for the label (which is a must, because the label is a registered company that HAS to report any payments it makes, sorry ppl, but that is the way the system works everywhere), something that in most of the cases makes it impossible for the label to pay. now dont jump, this is not an excuse but en explenation for many ppl who shout 'we got robbed!', but when you go deeper you see that the label has asked REPEATEDLY for an invoce and never got one.
3. In order to get themselves heard, artists MUST send demo material for labels to review. and the label, dear artists, has the right not to like what it gets, or even decide not to release the music, as much as you might like it yourselves. Labels DO NOT pay for demo material.
4. I do agree that labels DO fuck artists (I am one to know the other side of the stick with USTA, still haven't got paid for Digital Drops which was released, what? 3-4 years ago? shame on you...). But there are always artists who DO fuck labels - but twisting meanings and discussions, publishing their own personal view on situations that the readers cannot know. I dont say that Menog is wrong, I dont know what happend there, but this thing DO happen, this ALSO destroys the scene - ppl don't trust a label because an artist feel he got fucked by it, but if you look at the contract you see that everything is in order and the aritst simply wanted his/her/their money earlier.
So I hope I didnt looke the line here, it was very long.
I hope that artists find out a bit information before diving into the 'professional' world of music publishing and know more about what they are doing. on the other hand, labels shouldn't abuse the fact that they can actualy get away without paying and nobody can do anything about it (except report it to Isratrance authorities  )
Kind Regards,
Tal Cohen
A&R
Com.pact records
auspexx@compact-records.com |
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hercules
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
28
Posts :
148
Posted : Aug 18, 2003 09:43
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well due to my experience my hamble opinion:
most greek artists ask money from labels when they release their music but NONE is registered anywhere,
So the labels have to give money that never appear on the account books
all artists work like amateurs
none of the artsist pay taxes for what they want to get
all are illegal but always speak like pro
BTW for Menog:Your album sold around 600 copies and something and this is what john was payed from his distributor or he wait to get payed. |
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KakoOlalaJwal
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
116
Posts :
2565
Posted : Aug 18, 2003 11:31
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Hercules, Helen & Detox explained many important (crucial even) things..
I just wanted to ask the question but hercules (I think) already answered... about registration..
As an independant graphic designer, I am registered in the french institute INSEE which will fix my tax system (according to my incomes) and I've been delivered a SIRET number that must appear on each invoice I give to a client.
Same goes for photographs, sculptors, painters, and so on...
Our tax system is particular due to the nature of the service provided (creation) but DOES exists (and is necessary BTW for our retirement pension).
So I wonder what Menog and the others complaining can answer to the point that Hercules explained.
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"Get your dose of BoOgie !"
http://www.bunkum-records.com
http://www.myspace.com/zekakoo |
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Yuli
Retired
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
1660
Posted : Aug 18, 2003 15:07
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Giving a receit for payment received is the basic, and there should be no problem in doing so. That is one.
Second, to go back to Helen - to answer to all of it is too complicated, and I have to say u were rather objective about what u said, but only rather. Even in what u said u screwed most of the artists... Let's look deeper ( just for fun )
If the label waits for the expences on the manufacturing to be covered, then it means that the artist and the label go 50%-50% in this.. is that right? But most artist ( full album ) contracts signed for 18% to 30% for the artists... So how come that on expences of nearly 3000usd$ suddenly the split is even? hehe nice one no?
One thing more... I think it is very good that the artists talk about their relationship with the label in public ( about the relevant parts ofcourse ). I think it makes other artists know the pro's and con's of their decisions from another party view, and not only from label manager that in many cases will paint an amazing picture of success and only after u would see the flops and shit going around.
So I wiuld say that in this relationship, much more chances of going wrong belong to the label side.
One more thing tho - there are labels that are rather honest and do things as they should - so that also should be known
A man with a "master plan" is often a woman |
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nobody4
Inactive User
Started Topics :
21
Posts :
358
Posted : Aug 18, 2003 15:09
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About registration: There is an artist organization (like EMI in israel) in every country. registration there costs some money (not too much) and secures artists rights, also across boundries.
Many trance artists prefere not to register, because its a hussle, and also some precentage of any income goes to the organization (this is a different question altogether, whether artist organizations are worth the money...).
Gentlemen, this is business. and in business there are rules. if you choose to skip some, you might have to 'carry the concequences'. I wish that everybody would be trustworthy and nobody will need written contracts in order to get their money, but that's the world we're livin in.
lots of success to all the artists and labels,
Tal
auspexx@compact-records.com |
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nirvana
Started Topics :
2
Posts :
141
Posted : Aug 18, 2003 16:05
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Somebody once told me that an artist gets around 1.30 - 1.50 Euros for each sold album.
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Stuntman
Started Topics :
0
Posts :
3
Posted : Aug 18, 2003 16:50
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I'm glad Menog came to an arrangement.
I hope you get your money dude.
I would just like to add myself to the long list of artists never paid by Starsound records (not even the advance money).
So to the rest of these artists:
What do you think guys?
Is it time to solve this matter legally?
I have a contract with Sin's signature here gathering dust...
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Triplex
Triplex
Started Topics :
22
Posts :
134
Posted : Aug 19, 2003 01:04
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ok guys.
DETOX wants to convince us that an invoice will automatically bring the owed money to the artists.
Hercules, in the same temper, states that un-registered artists are making life hard for the label owners and should not be payed or something.
Come on guys.. please. We all know that you would love avoid paying anyone, but PLEASE PLEASE dont say that it is our fault! We are not kids u know, neither the people in this forum. Money not arriving to the artist's hands is 99% the label's fault. There are one million excuses for delaying payments and I have already heard all of them by ELEMENT, STARSOUND and NEUROBIOTICS.
And hercules, with all the respect, could you please stop ditching the "amateur" guys who make you famous and rich? This kind of -I am the best- behaviour does not make you more cool or something, trust me.
Regarding registration and taxes I think you know that people making 300 euros per year from something, this something is not considered to be a taxable job. Just imagine artists who have released music and had received 0 euros! hahah how much tax should those guys pay ?
think of it
ps.1 Stuntman : menog did not came to an agreement, he just got the usual 'I will pay you on the end of next week' thing. Don't you remember ? heh
ps.2 Yuli : very nice idea about sharing experiences of good collaborations. Who knows, maybe we could have a Top10 for label professionalism one day. hehe
http://triplex.trance.net |
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