Astral Projection is a fake

On 2007-05-01 19:09, mubali wrote:
Fuck that...

If you're going to come, come for the music... not for fame. not because you were some big name 10 years ago... Just come and give it your best because you like to play music and you like going to parties.. I charge less because it's not about money, it's the chance to share this part of your soul with like minded people... If you just take bookings with no regard of who it's for, then maybe it's not about the music for you... I try to be reasonable for serious promoters that I like their vibe... If I don't like the people throwing the party, I won't take the booking... It doesn't matter how much they offer.... If it's not in the spirit, then I become part of the problem and not part of the solution....

On 2007-05-03 14:31, Wombatmusic wrote:

Quote:

On 2007-05-03 04:19, The Journey Man Project wrote: Quote: On 2007-05-02 16:19, spytooned psytones wrote: Quote: On 2007-05-02 15:11, The Journey Man Project wrote: don;t judge me. Don't judge others. People have much more diversity to them - All has a psychological explanation.. Your words above seemed harsh and unfair to mister Wombatmusic, I guess. Ok... I never said I agreed with the violence.. I simply do not agree or can never accept people getting paid simply for a name... if you a getting paid to do something, then you should do it 100% true... if not then you don't get paid... it's called doing your job... if I don;t do my day job, I don;t get paid, or else I get fired... it just really shits me that people in this and in the general music and entertainment scene, get paid so much money for doing nothing.

Firstly. Dont send me private messages with insults dude. There's no need for that.

Secondly. You can not really blame the artists. I bet everybody including yourself would say yes thanks if you got offered good money for doing nothing Especially in times where months in the studio end up in massive stealing of your work!

Blame the Organizers who don't bother to book quality music and artists who actually work for their money on stage. Or blame the audience who really could not care less what the artists are doing on stage as long as there's a KIK and a Bass playing! Just look at certain artists who are the most busy in the scene. None of them play a single note on stage. They all stay with their arms in the air getting worshipped like Gods even though they probably got no clue how to actually play a note or set up a live set.

But at the end of the day if the Organizers keep booking them and the Audience keep buing the tickets. Then can you really blame the artists for saying yes?

On 2007-05-03 19:02, Colin OOOD wrote:
It seems to me that the only criteria is whether the music - the end product - is of a good enough standard, with no reference to how it was made, whether the artist can perform an adequate stage show, or even whether the named artist was the actual originator of the music in question (Alien Project comes to mind here).

On 2007-05-03 21:26, Pavel wrote:

Aren't you like banned and stuff?

On 2007-05-03 19:02, Colin OOOD wrote:
Lets think about why artists become well-enough known to get booked in the first place. The main way is through having tracks released, whether on compilations or artist albums; generally these releases are on record labels not controlled by the artists themselves. When the record is released, the label promotes it appropriately; when we as punters read the track list on compilations we then make the assumption that the artists represented on the CD have been chosen because their work is good. After all, the label wouldn't have spent so much money on it if they weren't, would they?

But what criteria do labels use to choose their releases? It seems to me that the only criteria is whether the music - the end product - is of a good enough standard, with no reference to how it was made, whether the artist can perform an adequate stage show, or even whether the named artist was the actual originator of the music in question (Alien Project comes to mind here). Given that live performances are such a big part of the psytrance scene, and help promote both the artists and their labels to the CD-buying/downloading public, it seems to be incredibly short-sighted of labels to release and promote acts who can't truly perform their music live (within the obvious constraints of the genre); can you imagine a small rock label signing a band who can't play live? And can you imagine such a band surviving for a long time without building up a fan-base through gigs? Of course, the rock scene is not the trance scene, but as far as I can tell the basic principles of music promotion, performance and success are the same in any genre.

It seems clear to me that it is the labels who have led us to this point. By only focussing on the short-term aspect of the business they have neglected a vital aspect of music-making which has the potential not just to increase their reach and revenues, but also to develop real musical talent in the trance genre that would lead to long-lived artists who command respect both within the trance scene and further afield. It is therefore the labels who, in their search for a quick result, have continually lowered the expectations of listeners and partygoers until we are satisfied to jump up and down at parties whilst shit is poured into our ears by grinning con-men with their hands in promoters wallets. I'm not saying it's a deliberate thing; rather it's something that's happened gradually from the very beginning, when it was only dedicated musicians with access to expensive electronic equipment who made this music.

Think about it... of the trance artists and producers with wider recognition outside the scene, how many actually perform musically during their live sets? I think the answer is 'pretty much all of them'. Skazi, Infected Mushroom, Shpongle... all these acts contain performing musicians who actually play instruments on stage. You can bet their legacy will be more than a few compilation releases, too.

To conclude... I don't think it's the organisers' fault; they will only book acts who will bring a crowd. If labels stop signing 'press play and dance' artists and start consciously developing those with the talent to give something unique and musical on stage, organisers will soon become much more able to book live acts worth watching - and worthy of their fee.

IMO... and probably only one of a number of reasons why this kind of thing happens.

On 2007-05-04 01:00, mubali wrote:
It's very interesting that you bring that up Colin. Let's discuss other electronic music genres then, let's say house and techno for instance.... Most of the djs and artists get paid pretty well, and many of them don't even play instruments either. Very few play live, and in the case of house most producers are barely known in comparison to the dj. Nobody gives a crap whether such and such artist actually is playing their music in real time, because they're there actually to listen to what this person is gonna play.

On one hand I can totally see where you are coming from with your frustration, but this music wasn't originally about the live performance to begin with.

Nobody could really afford to fly around with their whole studio to the beaches of goa where it's more than likely that your synths and compressors would get ruined in that climate.

Labels aren't just gonna get on a plane and go see some producers live set before they buy a track from them, that's just not all that logical. In fact it's very rare for any artist to have a really competent live set put together before they start releasing tracks.

As for the artists you mentioned, all of them gained their notoriety by making sure they can reach a wide market with their music, whether they play their stuff in real time is secondary.. It would be like asking Dr. Dre to play his tunes live, and rap on top of it.

I see your points Colin, and do apologise for maybe making a tongue in cheek comment about your intention on your original post. However the comment about Dre, yeah he does do his bit. which is rapping on stage when he isn't lip synching... I used to work for a few concert agencies in Northern Cali and got to see the setup for a dre show.... Some non plugged in Technics 1200 and a powerbook just offstage...

The real thing I was getting at about this is just like most electronic based music, the people that make the music are mainly studio musician and it would be a shame to discredit their talents just because they didn't actually learn a real instrument. This music is not just about melodies, it's about abstract sound creation. I've been a concert violist for 10 years prior to getting into electronic music and the only skills from that that I feel apply to the music I make and enjoy is the theory I learned, and how to analyze harmonic structure.