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are there or aren't there good studio headphones?
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bandarlog
Bandarlog
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809
Posted : Feb 11, 2004 17:41
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OK, I've read the posts about studio monitor alternatives. But it didn't answer the question I have. I can't afford (for the moment) studio monitors. Secondly: I don't want to harass my neighbours (any more). So are there headphones that come near the quality of studio monitors (in the price range of 50-100€, about 60-110 USD)? Which ones should I check? |
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FluoSamsara (Oxygen)
IsraTrance Full Member
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1164
Posted : Feb 11, 2004 19:19
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check the akg240 but have some cheap speakers to compare the sound at least...
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Te_nTe
IsraTrance Junior Member
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444
Posted : Feb 11, 2004 22:03
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dont think that heaphones even akg is enough.
it is just not providing you needed amount of bass.that the main reason. |
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Colin OOOD
Moderator
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Posted : Feb 11, 2004 22:13
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Sennheiser HD25SP are pretty good.
There are lots of good cans out there in your price range though. |
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Mike A
Subra
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Posted : Feb 11, 2004 22:14
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I got Sennheiser HD500, and it delivers more bass than needed.
And it has a hole in about 500-1000khz.
other than that they're ok 
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FluoSamsara (Oxygen)
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 11, 2004 22:18
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Quote:
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On 2004-02-11 22:03, Te_nTe wrote:
dont think that heaphones even akg is enough.
it is just not providing you needed amount of bass.that the main reason.
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Well, if hes got no money to get something else right now better start somewhere no?
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ird
Started Topics :
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Posted : Feb 12, 2004 00:18
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My $0.02:
I don't think that headphones can be a substitute for studio monitors. You will never get enough low end without equalization, and even if some headphones (mostly hi-fi, non-studio) give you a seemingly big bass, it does not come for free.. you pay for it by less precision in mid-high frequencies.
I have the AKG k271 Studio, as well as some standard Technics RP-HT700 which have clearly exaggerated lows and highs. At first I thought that the Technics sound much better (giving fuller, richer sound), but then realized that you cannot mix with them - the bass is so exaggerated that you lose details in the low-mids and even mids and highs. The AKGs, on the other hand, give very flat and precise results, while the lows seem attenuated.
Then I did a simple test in soundforge: using simple synthesis, created several short samples containing sine waves of different frequencies (15 Hz to 19000 Hz) and checked how they sound on both headphones. Well, it turned out that the AKG have even more extended bass (I could hear the 15 Hz wave, while the Technics were quiet up until 25 Hz!). On the AKG, all samples sounded at about the same volume, while the Technics had clearly pronounced resonance peaks in the lows and highs.. no wonder this gives the impression of a richer sound! However, resonance is _always_ bad, since it squashes other frequencies rather badly.
Try this test on your headphones, and you'll see how some manufacturers overstate their frequency range... AKG are quite honest, though.
Anyway, my post just confirms what has already been said: headphones are not enough; get some monitors (or speakers).
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bandarlog
Bandarlog
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44
Posts :
809
Posted : Feb 12, 2004 02:21
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Thanks for the replies! 
Still not sure. I'll probably go check out and perhaps adjust my last song in someone else's studio with monitors and see what the difference is and then check out some of the headphones you mentioned (if that's posible somewhere).
cheers
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DJ_Chorman
IsraTrance Junior Member
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85
Posted : Feb 12, 2004 02:30
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the sony headphones V7000 DJ/remix are flimsy, avoid them if you can.... they broke on me..... sure they cool cool... but..................................................
Pioneer maybe?????
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Kaz
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 12, 2004 03:09
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Quote:
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On 2004-02-12 00:18, ird wrote:
Well, it turned out that the AKG have even more extended bass (I could hear the 15 Hz wave, while the Technics were quiet up until 25 Hz!).
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Unfortunately, humans can hear theoretically down to 20Hz and practically from around 30-35Hz and up. If you can hear 15Hz on your headphones, it's a problem (I am assuming we are talking sinewaves here, as this does not apply to any other waveform - and you really can't test frequency ranges properly on anything that isn't a sinewave anyways).
 http://www.myspace.com/Hooloovoo222 |
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ird
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Posted : Feb 12, 2004 10:40
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to kaz:
Ok, let's say I can "feel" the difference when I start and stop playing the 15 Hz sample on the AKGs. Of course I can't hear the tone, but something is obviously there... the tonal presence starts to appear at about 30 Hz, all right.
One more thing about sound flatness.. since the sensetivity of the human ear changes with frequency (highs and lows are attenuated), you perceive flat sound as lacking in lows and highs... when I said that I heard all samples at about the same loudness on the AKG, I was not being completely honest.. of course the mids seemed much more pronounced (due to human ear perception, not headphone response), but there were no apparent resonance peaks in the lows and highs. However, if your headphones sound _louder_ in the lows and highs than in the mids, there's a problem.
Useful link:
http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/audioprinciples/interconnects/PhysicsofHearing.html |
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ird
Started Topics :
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Posted : Feb 12, 2004 12:07
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...and another one:
http://www.theothersidebbs.com/html/Music%20Spaces/Booth/Midi_Reads/Got_Midi5/Got_Midi5_27.html
Here's an interesting quote:
"Frequency Response: The range of frequencies that the headphones can reproduce effectively. The audible bandwidth is 20 Hz - 20,000 Hz (or 20kHz). Outside that range, sounds are not audible to most human ears (except the occasional sound professional and of course, "golden ear" audiophiles - who can often hear into the Megahertz range). Ultra-low frequencies (less than 20Hz) are more felt than heard. Beware claims of a measured "flat" frequency response (sometimes listed as 20Hz to 20kHz +/- 3dB). A headphone with a true flat response will sound terrible, because what the ears perceive as a "flat" response actually has many peaks and valleys due to interaction of the sound with the listener's head before it reaches the ears. Instead, headphones are often equalized to sound flat."
So here's the difference between studio and conventional (hi-fi) headphones: studio headphones deliver true flat sound (which takes time to get used to, but being able to hear the "true" frequencies is essential for accurate mixing), while typical hi-fi headphones color the sound (otherwise noone would buy them -- what is good for a sound engineer, is bad for the average listener). |
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A.Rosengren
Solid Snake
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266
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4139
Posted : Feb 13, 2004 01:25
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I have the AKG Acoustics K240 Studio and i am MORE than satisfied...
i have a pair of active monitors too but sometimes i actually prefer to put the headphones on instead to be honest...
my 0.2$
A
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Waveman
Psionyx
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107
Posted : Feb 13, 2004 02:01
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Like Mike, I also have the Sennheiser HD500. The best headphones I've ever used... but be aware that headphones seem to be much more a matter of a personal taste in terms of the sound compared to monitors.
I actually do most of my work using the HD500's, except when it comes time for final master. I'm just used to working this way and for the most part I don't miss the extreme low end (sub 20Hz). In fact I prefer to EQ out those pesky signals anyway, since my kicks and bass live at 50Hz and up.
-=Psionyx=-
"We make you feel strange." |
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Mike A
Subra
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Posted : Feb 13, 2004 13:23
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Waveman, you don't have a problem of not hearing the freqs around 500-1000?
maybe even lower 300-700 or something.
Cause it quite annoys me...
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