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Any good artists willing to release examples?
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mubali
Mubali
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71
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Posted : Apr 21, 2010 02:15
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On 2010-04-19 16:41, Maine Coon wrote:
But consider this: when you learn to play an instrument, you play some established composer’s music and use note sheets. And later you study composition on those classical examples too – before you start composing anything of your own. You don’t just open a piano and press keys in hope that something cool will come out.
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You are correct, in a sense. But with any instrument, you have a bit of a limitation to notes and frequencies... most instruments only cover 3-4 octaves in range, and even then there's only about 2 octaves that the instrument plays with full body. So the music that is constructed for the instrument is geared toward the specialty for it. Yes you learn how to play an instrument based upon other peoples creations, however it's partially meant to give you the understanding of where the instrument's power comes from.
Traditional music comes with already a set amount of limitations with scale and time, so before you even really get to play a single tune on piano, you have to learn scales and chords and musical key. Sightreading is a different subject, but then you're not really understanding the meaning behind the music, you're just regurgitating the note from paper to instrument. But that's a different subject... my main point is: You can't just pick up a guitar and buy a jimi hendrix book and expect to be able to play just like him, but if you've been practicing your ass off for a while and pick up this book, you just might learn something from his style and incorporate it into your own.
  An Eagle may soar, but Weasels don't get sucked into jet engines. |
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Maine Coon
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Apr 21, 2010 05:27
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Mubali, I get what you are saying. To continue the same analogy - I need to learn to play scales before asking somebody for notes of their music. And not only scales but at least some expressive stuff: modulate this and that etc. At this stage, looking through somebody’s live packs is actually overwhelming anyway. Even dissecting Operator presets is. That’s why I kept on bothering people with questions on how to start – so that I don’t spend the next 4 years tweaking an envelope on a kick.
Anyway, here is what I thought may be better for a complete noob than somebody’s live packs: a remix. It forces you to figure out the original arrangement of the track, pick the bass line by ear, play with the mix balance to get as close to the original as possible. I will need all these skills for producing my own tracks anyway. And then I can cut out some notes or whole phrases and replace with something of my own. At least that’s what I think remixing means, I am not sure. Anyway, if it does not end with Tsabeat sending hit men my way – it should be a great first experience 
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the daleks
The Daleks
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Posted : Apr 21, 2010 07:42
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agreed. remixing is a great way to learn production. i guess thats what i was trying to say.
selling of live packs could also be an alternative way for artists to make some extra cash.. not saying i would be willing to do it myself, but what Tom Cosm and Soundmagus, and some of the other indepth tutorial kits is kind of similar. any knowledge without an application and intent is of questionable usefulness, so indeed it is encouraged for new artists to want to make music for the love of it, and getting into the meat of the sound and engineering, and yes it does take ALOT of time. anyone wanting the quick road should consider DJing instead
Gamma Riders EP out now on iTunes and Amazon.com!
The Daleks : www.myspace.com/thedaleksupreme
A-Boys : www.myspace.com/akibaboys |
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-=Mandari=-
Mandari
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Posted : Apr 21, 2010 10:52
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hey greg, long time ago 
sooo first i never found me to work on stuff i like to listen to at least i was never able to mix my stuff with others. i dont want to talk about my music here, cause this sure is always a matter of taste and imo some hard for an artist, cause an real artist will never be satisfied with his work.
why i think the stuff doesnt fit the place? cause i had to learn just everything from scratch and for years on my own. if you got a person teaching you, this will lead at the end to the same like when you exchange sounds/projects with someone teaching you (if you´re just beginning). you wont sound unique. but i see some difference between there, it´s mostly loss on unique style in form of finding ways and techniques to work on sounds and composition in general, not that one trys intentionally to copy someone else, but one copys or adapts many many things from the one teaching..... so im not with that.
sure always talk about music and production here and there, take this advice, go that way someone mentioned. but im no fan of this teached by another artist way.... it´s always good and benefit if you´re already on some point able to finish a track in composing and stuff, know the basics and just want to learn more. but if someone´s teaching you how to get kick/bass you will MAYBE find all the other ways after years IF you do. if not, this means a lot of unique techniques that you will miss.
so.... if i google the same i will find thousands of ways other people mention how to achieve the stuff i need (not talking bout youtube, piuuuh). i´m able to see all the points and ways, goods and bads from the techniques and i know from scratch that there is more than one way. a guy who teaches you maybe forgets to mention or is not able to describe another way. i even can think about how to get the stuff i need from these or by mixing these techniques. imo much faster than if one trys to explain for hours what this is for and what you can do with it. just confusing, cause most artists are no professionel teachers, they´re artists usually just thinking too complex to explain something easy in own words same easy as it is
see my points maybe, anyways just my thoughts about that, imo it took me more time this way, but i learned far more that way. and, kinda more important, i found more things like ways and techniques on how to work on sounds and composition, step by step and you decide how fast to learn. often someone teaching is just rababerrababerrababer without the possibility to even follow the lips
at the end it´s better imo to read and read and read again and again and learn from these things, use your brain, compare, mix, try around and most important, try stuff other people would never do!! an absolutely DONT in general could get an absolutely DO in psymusic 
so, at the end i sadly believe the only way is a long hard road you have to walk down alone to create something really new and different to the stuff already done by thousands. to me it is just a huge amount of audio (real audio, not this destroyed mp3 shit kidz love to listen today, its just destroyed sound, so leave that if you wanna learn) i have to listen to, another huge amount of stuff i have to read and the sum of these both amounts could make the time i have to work trial and error. and i would never call me an experienced artist or producer so far, same like above, an artist is usually sure one will never come to that point
dont mind the novel, early in the morning, no coffee so far
cheers: stephan
FUCK GENRES, LOVE MUSIC!!!!
http://soundcloud.com/mandarimedia
http://banyan-records.com |
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TimeTraveller
IsraTrance Full Member
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80
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3207
Posted : Apr 21, 2010 11:37
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Hey Stephan!
Nice to see your input here.
I understand all your points.
I just think if we are sure and know sth well,we all can be teachers.
Your spirit - is the energy - which makes you unique IMO.
Not really the techniques,if them are from reading,seeing,listening or youtube.
The same technique can be designed in many ways.
I also think out of the dozen thousands of artist or people who releases music,like each day in this genre - there are maybe hundred real proffesionals.Guys who sell their music for a life.I might be wrong maybe two hundred.
It is always interesting to see other people working,especially since a lot of descriptions on forums are often very vague and time stealing.
I also would be mostly intertested in balance dynamics and eq comparings to others sources of ones tracks tbh than to any sound design of others.
This things I would be intersetd in could only improve the quality of sound.
Only interested - and that is all.
Personaly I like to know more that is my nature.
I learned a lot from Tsabeats remix - from seeing and analysing the audio files..that gave me alot that nobody could answer my phreaky questions a few times in this forum before.
Making other music in my life for a while ,I also can say it is great to collab with other guys it is fun and enriching of many things.
Imo you will always make your style your way and there will always be your completely own energy when looking on other beats and later making own.
Its often things that you would never use again that you see from others..
You still have more knowledge when sharing works with others .
The hard work will never end if one is a real artist I completely agree.One probably would be always unsatisfied and see amounts of failures - even when others are looking on your ancient works or releases as sth brilliant.
Greetings!
the mad Dominik
https://soundcloud.com/shivagarden |
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mubali
Mubali
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Posted : Apr 21, 2010 12:03
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I can totally understand what you're talking about Stephen... in my history I've gotten perspectives from many artists and used all the knowledge I acquired about production to formulate my own opinion about some things. What I might think isn't the authority, but since when does someone only take the advice from one source anymore?
The days are long past for there to be one single authority on anything, so you take the information that seems to be congruent and add your own take on the matter.
An Eagle may soar, but Weasels don't get sucked into jet engines. |
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-=Mandari=-
Mandari
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655
Posted : Apr 21, 2010 20:42
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hey greg,
perspectives btw... im interested in your one, saw you´re still in berlin would be a pleasure to meet you on msn again.
hey dominik, my pleasure, nice to hear some news =D
sorry for offtopic, so... i just wanna leave that my opinion above is sure just if you want to get started. at that point i guess no one would have a clue what someone else did in his project. without some basics you wont benefit from that.
anyways sure any way to learn something new is always welcome. just like someone already mentioned before i think many people (including me some while ) want to get forward too fast. it will all take the while it needs, no one knows. and i sure remember my thoughts some years ago that a project file from another artist would be cool to learn from. soon i found his site and downed one project from tom cosm and guess what...... chinese, right
so...... let me think of, it took me another few years to understand what he did. im on ableton live btw.... but i think it was some time i started workin on ableton, so .. anyways, it was complete french/chinese/shabubu but nothing i learned that time from.
well, watched his videos for years (still doin, great guy, always updates), and now with some knowledge about the basics i think i could explain to someone else what he did.
novel again, sorry for that.... too much coffee
cheers: stephan
FUCK GENRES, LOVE MUSIC!!!!
http://soundcloud.com/mandarimedia
http://banyan-records.com |
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TimeTraveller
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Apr 25, 2010 17:59
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Steph you're cool guy and tbh I hat too much coffee for sure as always Im so addicted to coffee hehe sorry for my novel here.Respect to all you cool guys in here.
https://soundcloud.com/shivagarden |
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cornerstone
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Posted : May 2, 2010 11:49
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I am a complete newb, as my post history will show. This thread has been extremely informative in both the technical and the philosophical.
Thanks for the post on Tsabeat and Soundmagus.
I am divided in opinion on seeing other artists project files. On the one hand seeing what Cosm does on youtube took me light years into the future. So I bought a membership with him. Upon seeing his project file megamix my mind was blown and that may have set me back a bit, realizing the task of production I wanted to achieve was so daunting. I've been a drummer most of my life and silly me thought most of that would be applicable. WRONG, at least in the production sense.
I do not regret however, paying for a membership because that was money well spent just in Gear purchase advice. As I am here in Eastern NC (with only my mixing partner, also a newb to production, to bounce ideas off of.)
This advice saved me a substantial sum in purchasing costs i.e. buy a vst oops... wrong one ect.
Also until I found you guys mubali and mandari et al
here on isratrance there was no real outlet to find psy specific info on production.
I could go on further with this topic but I fear I'm off topic and I should probably be more ears open rather than mouth open. Just thought i had a couple cents to offer. |
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cornerstone
Started Topics :
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Posted : May 2, 2010 12:48
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Nectarios
Martian Arts
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Posted : May 2, 2010 13:56
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If you are a total n00b, everything you need to learn from, is the manual of the software you are using.
I learned everything from scratch, went out and did a degree in audio tech, but I did not choose the software pathway cause I did not want to spend my classes on learning how to use Logic/Cubase/Pro Tools (although I have done Pro Tools classes, having Logic rewired, bliss!!).
The whole thought process and character building procedure that is to learn everything on your own, will get you much further as an artist and a person.
When you've got the habit of training your ears to analyze mixes and sounds, instead of having someone dial in synth parameters in for you, or pushing faders in a mixdown, you push your own "roof" of skills and expression, up high...whereas when you repeat the few things someone has taught you to make arrangements, and (hopefully) finish tracks, you hit their "roof" soon and repeat the same process you've been taught to make music....cause that is the only one you know anyway.
Disagree? Just look at the Israeli full on scene.
http://soundcloud.com/martianarts |
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
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162
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8087
Posted : May 2, 2010 15:58
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Quote:
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On 2010-04-16 17:15:54, Shiranui wrote:
I was wondering if any good artists are willing to release project files for one or two of their songs, for new producers to learn from.
Sound like a good idea?
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not really sure but i think subconsciousmind have some projects on his site , if not you might find usefull info http://www.subconsciousmind.ch/
in a way looking for projects to learn you will just get more limitation in your creativity cause you may try to do the same. |
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OpenSourceCode
Datavore
Started Topics :
26
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660
Posted : May 2, 2010 16:33
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aXis
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : May 2, 2010 20:27
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If ur an esatblished artist wit original work u wont care to share ur project files cos u would know that its not easy to copy originality |
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Medea
Aedem/Medea
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127
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Posted : May 4, 2010 01:33
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imho it's a very big hassle to analyze someones project file, presets etc...
not sure if it makes any sense...
Reading hardware and software manuals + communication with people (live, forums, any kind) is much more effective
http://soundcloud.com/aedem |
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