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Anarchy and Fuck For Forest Video by TimeWaveZero TV
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Axis Mundi
Axis Mundi
Started Topics :
75
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1848
Posted : Oct 9, 2009 23:48
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On 2009-10-07 23:19, Moki.Time.Wave.Zero wrote:
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| how much of whatever they get is really arriving in the forests? do they buy land themselves, do they support any organisations with that money? |
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here are two examples:
http://www.fuckforforest.com/news/News-300
forest in costa rica
25.10.06..... FFF buy 1 area of forest...... 67 700 NOK about 13234$ or 8499€
25.10.06.....................2 part......................67 700 NOK about 13234$ or 8499€
07.11.06.....................3 part......................56 600 NOK about 11073$ or 7107€
example two:
http://fuckforforest.com/news/
slovakia
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With that kind of money, they could have bought a piece of privately owned forest land somewhere in Europe years ago, organized sexually charged psytrance fundraiser parties all season long (where nobody would have the right to complain because the program would be obvious to anyone attending) or subleased the land to outside promoters for parties, continued doing what they are doing on the side, year round, made a LOT more money in the process which could go to all sorts of nature conservation efforts, expanded their participation group and fan base dramatically, supported the psy-trance scene and their own ideals a great deal more (such as safe/responsible/meaningful sex and STD awareness, for example) in doing so, and all together been a lot more effective and successful at their mission statement. they wouldn't need to spend thousands of euros "investing" just to travel to Universo Parallelo when they could put the same money and effort into promoting their idea and the psytrance scene which is hosting them right at home and let it spread to those places from there on its own merit. Everybody would be happy and it would totally be a win-win situation for all involved.
That's the part that really bugs me about it, is that their operation for years has been small potatoes, and under their current model always will be... they don't seem to be thinking about the bigger picture, they are ultimately selling themselves short in more ways than one and seem content to putting forth as little effort and hard work as possible into their goal. Nothing at all against them personally but really, it's no wonder why most people in this scene and the leftist-anarchist scene don't take them seriously and they are getting laughed at by people, and it's what makes what tHuJoN said, for example, so painfully obvious and true.
In short, even though they seem to have good intentions, they are basically wasting their time when they could have developed something much larger, more encompassing and successful over the years, just by being a bit more proactive instead of fucking each other for years and selling slightly different variations of the same low budget porn starring the same people for years for a relatively minimal amount of money.
With all due respect to them, it's no wonder why their peers and colleagues regard them in the way they do if you use the information and attitudes in this thread as a microcosmic example. Bless them for their intentions and their accomplishments so far but if they were using their MAIN erogenous organs, their minds, all this time, they could come up with something a LOT better over all this time.
It wold be one thing if they had just started doing this now and just getting their ideas off the ground, but they have apparently been doing this for years and have had plenty of time to use their efforts, ideas, and capital in much more effective and productive ways than they have. No, it isn't an easy thing to do and think of it this way, but that's why it's called "sacrifice", and that's why organizations like Greenpeace are so successful and they are not in comparison... because Greenpeace and others understand what "sacrifice" truly is and these guys don't.
It's been said that this troop are "warriors" for choosing to live against society, etc. and all that... but that's a real fallacy when you think about it because in comparison others are laying down in front of bulldozers and standing in the face of parliaments, congresses, autocrats, and corporations, laying down in front of bulldozers, whaling ships, and oil tankers, living in trees for long periods of time with NO basic amenities and having food raised up to them in a bucket when it can even be brought all the way to them, often in more-or-less lawless, TRULY anarchic environments.... and so much more and in their REAL courage for what they believe in, are actually getting shit done and enacting all sorts of sweeping social, governmental, and environmental change all over the WORLD. Now THAT'S what I call REAL warriorship, courage, and conviction. Not walking around naked at an anarchist convention (of all places where they could be get their message across by people in "power"!) and wanking each other in their promotional video.
I hope that one or more of them get to read this and take the constructive criticism for what it is, and not get too offended over it and maybe be inspired to think outside of their own idealistic boxes on the issue.
@ Basilisk:
I don't think it's so much of a general acceptance and passivity of environmental destruction (I don't think anyone here is "cool" or "down" with that sort of thing) more than the general feeling that people seem to have that this group is parodizing the whole issue when they feel there are all sorts of other easy ways to do some real work for the change they seek, and there are people who don't get to make such a promotional video because they are out actually doing it instead of sitting around their dens filming each other screwing. |
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moki
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
38
Posts :
1931
Posted : Oct 10, 2009 01:43
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yeah, buy a forest in europe with 30000 euro.
but before this, send this message to all organisers of festivals and ppl who release you, may be get another microscopic picture of the situation who likes fuck for forest and who doesnt.
and btw sure you know what leftist anarchist scene are you talking about?
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Aluxe
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
25
Posts :
725
Posted : Oct 10, 2009 02:11
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I really don't see what the problem is with these guys or why they need to be put down by comparing them with other more organized, serious and effective eco organizations. Maybe these guys just love playing around and decided to add an eco element to their fun, and there is nothing more to it. So what would be wrong with that? Hey even if they just donate 20 or 10% of the money they make to an environmental cause that’s better than what most people do. So what is the fuss? Oh I know.. it’s the sex element. And since people can not come up with real arguments against their sexual openness other than "its offensive" "its bad taste" "bunch of perverts" etc they attack the eco work they are doing.
If these guys were artists painting and selling pictures and donating a small amount of their earnings for the forest nobody would be attacking them, quite the contrary.
And they apparently purchased some land in Costa Rica to be preserved which is great! If everyobody did the same the world would not be in such bad shape. And I wonder who on this forum can say they have purchased land to be preserved or something comparable like these guys? I mean if you are going to be so quick to point the finger at these guys about their not good enough eco efforts, then its fair to assume that you are doing something more than they are. And if you aren't maybe you should go plant some trees or buy some piece of forest and then talk.
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mk47
Inactive User
Started Topics :
118
Posts :
4444
Posted : Oct 10, 2009 05:23
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let me ask u this aluxe , how would you feel if your mum and dad , or sister decided to have a go at this ?
the thing here is , I have always believed that there has to be some element of hardwork and sacrifice and effort on your part if you want to make a difference , throwing around some very easily made cash with none of those things means it all comes to 0 , for me anyway . I would rather , as i have been , donate to the wwf some of my hard earned money , and would encourage people to do the same .
``If these guys were artists painting and selling pictures and donating a small amount of their earnings for the forest nobody would be attacking them, quite the contrary.``
- Artist painting vs http://xplicite.free.fr/images/fuck4forest.jpg 
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Axis Mundi
Axis Mundi
Started Topics :
75
Posts :
1848
Posted : Oct 10, 2009 09:32
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On 2009-10-10 01:43, Moki.Time.Wave.Zero wrote:
yeah, buy a forest in europe with 30000 euro.
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First of all, you said:
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| well 45000 euro. i dont know, it is really not so little. |
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Which is 150% of 30,000 AKA a huge difference. (Your numbers don't add up anyway, Ms. You-guys-with-other-opinions-don't-know-what-you're-talking-about).
Secondly, it's not impossible, as you are implying. There are ways to get money, and credit, and places in Europe where land is cheap. Especially with a down-payment, anything is possible, and the amount of private land you need for a party is not too terribly huge.
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but before this, send this message to all organisers of festivals and ppl who release you, may be get another microscopic picture of the situation who likes fuck for forest and who doesnt. |
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What would be the point of me doing that? Their reputation is their responsibility, not mine. Judging from some of those pictures, there are already some organizers of big events working with them, so what are you trying to say there, exactly?
At least I'm trying to be constructive and come up with ideas, instead of the usual bashing but I suppose even that is below your razor-thin tolerance level, especially because you can't see past the fact that you don't like me.
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and btw sure you know what leftist anarchist scene are you talking about?
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If you are referring to this quote of mine:
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| why most people in this scene and the leftist-anarchist scene don't take them seriously |
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I am talking about the same that tried to throw them out of their convention, something you have already brought up several times and was talked about heavily in their video.
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| I really don't see what the problem is with these guys or why they need to be put down by comparing them with other more organized, serious and effective eco organizations. Maybe these guys just love playing around and decided to add an eco element to their fun, and there is nothing more to it. So what would be wrong with that? Hey even if they just donate 20 or 10% of the money they make to an environmental cause that’s better than what most people do. |
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Because it started out in this conversation that those organizations were compared unfavorably to FFF, which is absolutely absurd and ridiculous compared to the reverse.
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| And they apparently purchased some land in Costa Rica to be preserved which is great! If everyobody did the same the world would not be in such bad shape. And I wonder who on this forum can say they have purchased land to be preserved or something comparable like these guys? I mean if you are going to be so quick to point the finger at these guys about their not good enough eco efforts, then its fair to assume that you are doing something more than they are. And if you aren't maybe you should go plant some trees or buy some piece of forest and then talk. |
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If you want to call me out for being critical, I own 100 acres of forest land in Maine which will never be logged. Not too much, I know, but I bought it through hard work. I must really suck for being so critical, huh?
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| but i am interested to have an answer of a question as well. what if they are interested in first place to make sex and be observed? |
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I step around enough used condoms on the street as it is, and I certainly don't want to slip or sit in somebody's cum on the subway or bus, thanks.
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| like you can never become a good musician if you are not totally crazy about music, and you can never be a good programmer if you are not totally crazy about scripting and coding. and you can only do an activity successful if you are totally dedicated to it in your heart. so it is quite logical that they like to make sex and be observed isnt it? |
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None of that is true. Some people are born from the beginning with those talents and skills, some learn them through rigorous training, or both, whereas EVERYTHING is born with the sexual instinct which doesn't need to be taught or learned. This is why all living beings are capable of reproducing on their own without needing to be taught how to do it, but you don't have any warthog violin virtuosos or venus-fly-trap computer hackers.
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TranceVisuals
TranceVisuals
Started Topics :
23
Posts :
743
Posted : Oct 10, 2009 10:24
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On 2009-10-10 09:32, Axis Mundi wrote:
If you want to call me out for being critical, I own 100 acres of forest land in Maine which will never be logged. Not too much, I know, but I bought it through hard work. I must really suck for being so critical, huh?
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Party at yours then.... 
On the otherhand Axis, you have raised some interesting points, that I didn't want to raise, incase Moki thought I was being deliberately antagonistic.
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Axis Mundi
Axis Mundi
Started Topics :
75
Posts :
1848
Posted : Oct 10, 2009 11:09
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Sorry for posting so soon after my last post, but I wanted to take the time to sum up my personal stance on the issue.
Do I think people need to adopt a more free/comfortable attitude towards sex? Yes.
Am I happy/supportive that FFF has found a positive outlet for their goals/ideals? Yes. (I've said before that people like FFF are one of my favorite things about visiting Berlin, and besides, being supportive and critical are two different things.)
Do I think they could be doing/could have been doing more to further their goals more effectively? Yes. Much more. But that of course doesn't apply to just them but rather everybody in the world.
Do I think they are noble for their way of achieving what they want? No. It's nice to see self-indulgence used positively, though.
Do I think it's courageous? No. (Not compared to what others in the world are doing.) That is not to imply that I think it is cowardly, however.
Do I think one person's freedom ends where another's begins? Yes. If they are doing their thing in a private/secluded area, and a person comes in their presence (lol), that person has little right to complain if they don't like it. If they show up somewhere where a group has gathered for another purpose and begins activities which the group finds disruptive, they have no right to do so and the group has the right to allow, or ask/tell them to stop or remove them if needed.
People have the same rights to do what they want just as much as another has the right not to be part of/witness to it if they don't want to. If one person out of a group differs in their opinion, it is up to them to find somewhere else or another means to pursue their goals.
Do I think showing the proper respect to people (even if you disagree) versus "shock value" tactics is a constructive answer? No. It's deconstructive. (Dropping one's pants in a courtroom is not going to make anyone there think more positively of your statement. Shocking people is most likely to turn them against you.)
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Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
60
Posts :
3709
Posted : Oct 10, 2009 11:16
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Fuck for forest! haha
Fuck for childrens right in the world?
Fuck for poverty and hunger?
Hey why not fuck for music! that would sort a lot!
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Xolvexs
IsraTrance Senior Member
Started Topics :
241
Posts :
2848
Posted : Oct 10, 2009 12:16
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i dont see the relation between you satisfying your desires and saving a forests...yes you may be able to raise money, but if money could solve all the ecological problems we would not have ecological problems in the first place. i mean there already is enough awareness about the need for forests..what there isn't is the will to reduce consumption..how do u force people to reduce something like consumption? its like telling people to stop breathing for day...impossible, like it or not we will consume no matter what...people will still raise cattle, grow food and the fact that the population is rising these activities are only bound to increase. Even clean-technology will require you to "REPLACE" which is just a better word for consumption.
I think its merely a hype that the world is dying...its just another way to extend the life of the industrial revolution which is on its tail-end...and how do you extend it? tell people to change the petrol car to electronic and invest in solar instead of oil...the end result is still a big fukin 0...the fear mongrels are those who do not have faith in the ability of mother earth to restore herself...we add the human element of time and thats how the world comes to an end like it did on 31 Dec 1999 the Y2k...gosh i think its the same shit all over again...you cant save your own ass if you are attacked by a lion in the forest, how do u expect someone to believe that you can save? Again the concept of saving is human...saving taxes, saving lives, savings account, saving...its ridiculous... the universe is about abundance and there is abundance...the problem is the thought...since humans are the only ones capable of thinking beyond..they feel and fear something they cannot control.
And that feeling of fear and inadequacy my friend is what consumption is and the world runs on it. Its just access and control of resources. you may call it politics or you may call it fuck for forest...its all going nowhere...just relax and enjoy the show of nature...a few tornadoes, a few tsunamis a few dead people, its been happening all the time, just because u realized it now doesnt mean you can stop it...Nature is not like a car nor is it like an air-conditioner...its just keeps flowing. and how ever hard you try it will overpower you just acknowledge that you are just a dust particle in nature's way. forget about all the promises and fear you are being sold...just wash your face and consider yourself as a part of nature.
 When death comes to your doorstep, make sure you are alive |
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Elad
Tsabeat/Sattel Battle
Started Topics :
158
Posts :
5306
Posted : Oct 10, 2009 12:38
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i pay x10 for art that the money goes for forest then hippie porn that is lousy excuse for this nymphos to get fucked infront of all this people.. really now , how many people with money (i.e not hippies) will actualy listen to their agenda?? www.sattelbattle.com
http://yoavweinberg.weebly.com/ |
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Colin OOOD
OOOD/Voice of Cod
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Oct 10, 2009 13:33
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Ellon
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
56
Posts :
1223
Posted : Oct 10, 2009 13:38
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On 2009-10-10 05:23, mk47 wrote:
let me ask u this aluxe , how would you feel if your mum and dad , or sister decided to have a go at this ?
the thing here is , I have always believed that there has to be some element of hardwork and sacrifice and effort on your part if you want to make a difference , throwing around some very easily made cash with none of those things means it all comes to 0 , for me anyway . I would rather , as i have been , donate to the wwf some of my hard earned money , and would encourage people to do the same .
``If these guys were artists painting and selling pictures and donating a small amount of their earnings for the forest nobody would be attacking them, quite the contrary.``
- Artist painting vs http://xplicite.free.fr/images/fuck4forest.jpg
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If you rather donate for whatever your money please do so...i think it´s great, really!!!!
And let them fuck for forest in peace, even if in 2 years they are fed up of it, and move on to another thing.
I´m really disgusted to read stuff like " filthy hippies" or "Bestial" or "unnatural". Even if they really are nymphos at least they are putting their heart on it which is more than many here can say for themselves.
I never heard them talk about how great they are and how courageous they are or how noble...
I can also find it uninteresting(what they are doing) but it gives me no right to bash them because of it...
Moreover i ´ve been reading so many assumptions over here
https://soundcloud.com/arglebarglemusic
http://soundcloud.com/turvytopsy
http://soundcloud.com/capecodplatform |
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Djones
IsraTrance Senior Member
Started Topics :
267
Posts :
1766
Posted : Oct 10, 2009 16:25
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You could also pay me.
I don't do anything all day long, just sitting around being bored.
But if you donate, I will give everything to the forest.
It's like a win-win situation, I can continue being lazy and at the same time help the forest!
Sounds like a good idea doesn't it? |
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moki
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
38
Posts :
1931
Posted : Oct 10, 2009 16:33
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axis mundi Quote:
| you can't see past the fact that you don't like me. |
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i believe it is high time for you to realize that i am quite indifferent about you - i just comment the way you argument. and you can critises whatever you want - as you see , i am not having a go with anyone in this thread ( i would have one, only if i see that an obvious fact is distorted and not because someone has another opinion than i do).
i just commented this sentence of you:
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| it's no wonder why most people in this scene and the leftist-anarchist scene don't take them seriously and they are getting laughed at by people, and it's what makes what tHuJoN said, for example, so painfully obvious and true. |
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i am not sure that this is painfully obvious and true. is an isratrance forum presenting the one and only microscopic view of reality for you?
okey, lets say it like that, most ppl i know from the scene dont laugh on fff. i have seen quite a lot of prominence figures from the scene wearing fff t-shirts. why do they do this. strange if it is painfully obvious ...
another thing . this anarchist leftist scene you are talking about. i had a talk with one of the organazires one night at home , 10 hoiurs long on anarchy. i dont believe he has understood much of it. especially funny is if someone is shouting anarachy and is at the same time totally dependent on the support of the state or on the support of his capitalistically active wife. whatever.
the land - well i am trying to buy a flat or a house now too, if i had a forest for 30000 euro, i would buy it immediately. just dont think your opinion is based on reality. some organizers pay one third of this only for one week of festival....
but sure, there are many ways.
i just wondered about this sacrifice isssue you are talking about. does everything in life has to be a sacrifice (( put yourself in front of the bulldozers instead of just enjoy life and help the forest?)...it is quite a christian approach. like this dude who was sent to the cross and was a hero for the sacrifice hundereds of years after that.
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Elad
Tsabeat/Sattel Battle
Started Topics :
158
Posts :
5306
Posted : Oct 10, 2009 16:34
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On 2009-10-10 16:25, Djones wrote:
You could also pay me.
I don't do anything all day long, just sitting around being bored.
But if you donate, I will give everything to the forest.
It's like a win-win situation, I can continue being lazy and at the same time help the forest!
Sounds like a good idea doesn't it?
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well its not really about money its about energy saving and recycle and even parliament work to change rules before giving money that will make a real change IMO
and i also think those 'fuckers' (lol) could do more then fuck around.. there are more important acts that will get much more sympathy from the public thats all i say. they can keep fuck as much they want doesnt bother me for sure 
www.sattelbattle.com
http://yoavweinberg.weebly.com/ |
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