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All Those Who Want To Make Trance
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assaf_zo
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
46
Posts :
141
Posted : Sep 6, 2006 00:12
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i think if u hot, u hot
no matter if u fucked up talamasca - time stimulation till its go to other worlds of music or u make you own beat.
basicly u can see a band such as gnarls barkley
they sit on 60's gospel beat (structure) but got something new as well
try to do what feels good... open source MF !! 
great day and night
peace
  HUGE BIG BLUE-MARVEL THAT WE LIVE ON |
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snowflake
Started Topics :
9
Posts :
194
Posted : Sep 6, 2006 00:19
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On 2006-09-05 23:42, Colin OOOD wrote:
My main worry is that once the habit of copying is formed, it can be difficult to break.
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Don't you think you're a bit late? This habbit is with us for quite a while now...
and it's not a problem only in the trance scene.
Anyway, you're barking at the wrong tree, mate.
The only problem with this thread is that it was discussed about a million times by now, not it's subject.
Out Here We're Stoned.... |
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Colin OOOD
Moderator
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Sep 6, 2006 02:38
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There's been much talk on other sections of this forum about artists who used to have their own style but now sound just like a lot of other people - the word 'generic' has been used more than once. I'm prepared to be proved wrong here - can anyone give me an example of someone whose first releases sounded boring and generic, but whose later releases got more and more innovative and unique? I tend not to pay a lot of attention to the names or writers of a lot of the trance I hear so I can't answer the question myself.
Peace
Mastering - http://mastering.OOOD.net :: www.is.gd/mastering
OOOD 5th album 'You Think You Are' - www.is.gd/tobuyoood :: www.OOOD.net
www.facebook.com/OOOD.music :: www.soundcloud.com/oood
Contact for bookings/mastering - colin@oood.net |
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e-motion
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
71
Posts :
933
Posted : Sep 6, 2006 05:12
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some artists are inovating to an unique sound but it's really rare. i can give you an example colin, pretty well-known eskimo. if you listen to his tracks now they're pretty different than before, much more eskimo style, ballonatic part 2 will be available really soon and you'll be able to see that. but to tell the truth it's the only example i know. and it's just an humble opinion which i think most won't agree. just please don't flame me before you listen to ballonatic part2.
also i had the this-is-something-new-feeling when i listened to Dynamo's album, imho once again, i think eskimo is inovating the scene but i just hope the whole scene doesn't go after him.
Pyrex :: Traveling without moving
www.myspace.com/pyrexperience |
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djzed
Started Topics :
3
Posts :
48
Posted : Sep 6, 2006 07:42
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On 2006-09-05 23:26, New Era Scientist wrote:
anyway im drifting offtopic... structure of a track is how(well)its elements are executed in the timeline.... introducing a hook too early might make the track last shorter, introducing it too late might make a person lose interest... and so on, its so hard for a single creator to know this, it takes skill and to be objective, and just like when a writer writes a book he often let friends and colleagues have their input... so basicly thats what we can do, beside trust our selfs.
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Absolutely agree. I guess I don't like the fact that people see structure as so limiting to their music. They think that if you use someone else's structure then there's noway your music can be original. But people seem to forget about all the other ways you can make a track original
- Interesting melodies
- New rhythms
- Funky basslines
- New psycaldelic sounds
There's heaps of great original tracks that all use similar structures.
A message to people out there who are starting out with this stuff (and it seems many people disagree with me) but
DON'T FEEL BAD ABOUT USING SOMEONE ELSE'S STRUCTURE. It's the same as using someone else's production trick, mixing technique, synth programming advice or whatever. If you're stuck with the structure, or what your doing doesn't seem to be working, listen to your favourite track and analyse what their doing in it that makes all the sections in the track flow smoothly, and if you like it copy it.
You'll find it gives a starting point for your track, and then once uv finished laying out the whole track you can go back and make modifications to the structure.
"If you cannot create your own track stucture without the use of a template ...you are not talented enough to be a real artist"
It's bullshit. Anyone can learn this stuff, we are all talented in our own unique ways. You just need time and practise to bring out that true talent.
Just go for it, and have fun! |
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assaf_zo
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
46
Posts :
141
Posted : Sep 6, 2006 09:05
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marSpider
Started Topics :
8
Posts :
46
Posted : Sep 6, 2006 15:35
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On 2006-09-03 21:54, New Era Scientist wrote:
its a simple fact that without experience you wont make a commercial standard track, if thats what you want to do...
by copying structure you wont learn more than that there are 100000000000000 ways to make a track. and structure is something even a person that dont play any instrument or work with music can do, sometimes even better.
just learn music and learn about your self and learn how to express your self... and here is the hunch, you can express your self with/through other peoples music, but the ultimate thing is to be the innovator.
there are lots of tracks that has been the ground to something completely different, a good thing is to know that and take notice of it.
and i agree with colin allthough i expand on it,
-let your hearth and soul and body be the instrument. it occurs to me often when i programm music... its much more fun to be apart of it with your body, more satisfaction in my opinion.
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i'M NO EXAMPLE but i feel both have reason xpecially colin
when I started producing one of the things i did for example was remixing live.... played a few songs, opened reason and just had a bit of fun with it's rythm, drums(find BPM's)) and make some add'on, trying to get the bass and melodie notes and can't say it has made my tracks typical......... don't even know what they sound like
anyway guess it helped me practice music teory so i can do whatever i want(work on progress....) and as what i was trying was to keep on with a multi-style playlist (chill,trance,tecno,house,classical, freakazoid.....,...) didn't even get a chance to make a mental copy of the structure or something like that....
also if you are not in some xperimental work some "rules" should be +-followed but they're not about the music structure/progression i think more about the right use of scales(with some dissonant notes,why not?), tempo, rythym just to get the vibe, your VIBE
FUc new track templates with bass, drums patched 
does the signature for me ---www.acidplanet.com/hypnosense |
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sideFXed
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
22
Posts :
430
Posted : Sep 6, 2006 16:12
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I don't want to make trance, I simply make
We all shouldn't cram our minds what to do, we should just do *it*!
The more we do a thing, the more various tracks we create.
Some ppl create 100-200 (that's just an assumption) tracks in 5 years, 20 out of them are hopefully special.
Others create 10 tracks in a year and most of the stuff is unique.
What's better... no1 can say that... It's all in the eyes of the observer. For my part, I like to hear similar stuff and also unique tracks. It's a question of mood.
I think it's funny how forum posts always get bashed in a way that one should be unique. Dudes, just let the boys and girls do their music, whatever makes their day.
soundcloud.com/epsylohm |
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organix
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
77
Posts :
136
Posted : Sep 6, 2006 17:40
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I think you should use some structure lessons from other people... it opens ideas...
I had the privilege of spending some time in the studio with Eskimo last month and we worked on some stuff together...
my tracks do not sound like Eskimo! I learned some really usefull tips on bassline and percussion and also some other techniques...
I had infected mushroom, Gms and Astral Projection program my Nord Lead for their live sets... I don't use thier presets...
Managed to get my hands on the Infected Mushroom midi files when they were around a while ago... studied them, didn't use them... love infected, but not my style.
Also spent some time with Nystagmus as well... I mean you should learn all you can, more benificial having them in front of your computer, than with a copy of thier track plastered into Cubase... but still...
Books I've read even say to do this...
For example eqing and mastering...
People do covers in Pop... Remixing a popular track is a good way to get started...
I don't feel you're going to ever sound the same...
I've never heard a cover sound the same as the original... Pop or Psy-trance.
To blatantly rip off a track and sell it as your own is lame, but to learn from the masters... you have to study thier tracks... I thinks it's a good starting point for beginners and intermediate producers...
I will play a track by another artist to get the eq settings right. (Usually after about 10 time slugging it out myself)
I have dropped XSI - Overzone into cubase and studied it's structure... only to go off on my own tangent about a minute or two in... sounded kinda wierd though, cuz I didn't want to write my track in B.
I feel I'm still intermediate for production, and still need all the help I can get... I mean, how can you get too much information on a scene that you love and are a part of... If tracks all start sounding the same... then someone's going to come along and revolutionize the scene... and blow everyone away!
which has happened numurous times in the psy scene...
influenced or plagiarism...
to keep the scene evolving you have to share ideas...
my 2 cents...
smiles.
chris.
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AjmaGard
AjmaGard
Started Topics :
8
Posts :
122
Posted : Sep 6, 2006 22:40
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still i think you will learn more by just dancing to your own music and feel it...
thats what i meant with using your body when you create..
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Now this is one of the best advices I have ever read on this board! Seriously!
Who cares if you have the fattest leads, the most solid bottom, or the trickiest killaaaaarrrh melodies if a track really does nothing to your body?
As an example, take out some of your old goa VA's... I mean the production is not top notch, the bottom is weak, but many of the tracks still hold.
One of my all-time favorite tracks is for instance "Talking Souls - Karma 209". IMHO it is one of the best tracks released at that time.
Of course your sound has to be good for the time you live in, but it is not what makes you a legend
*In AjmaGard We Trust*
http://www.soundcloud.com/ajmagard |
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0v3rd0s3d
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
26
Posts :
660
Posted : Sep 7, 2006 00:04
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On 2006-09-06 16:12, sideFXed wrote:
I don't want to make trance, I simply make
We all shouldn't cram our minds what to do, we should just do *it*!
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yap, exactly, let your mind talk ^^
first learn how to write YOUR music, because each track has it's own history and that history is inside your mind not gms guys *evil laugh*
yes it does take time, its like meditating, you cant reach the top in 5 hours  takes years..
with practice comes the perfection ^^
all the rest is pure knowledge you can aquire by reading a lot 
http://myspace.com/overthedose |
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Bone_Flute
Started Topics :
6
Posts :
18
Posted : Sep 12, 2006 19:57
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I agree with assaf_zo !
1.) We r not living on the dark side of the
moon ! -there4 everything inspiring
everyone.
2.) Why should i discover the wheel again ?
3.) Evan Beethoven stole ppl ideas and made
it better !
4.) This "from the bottom of your heard
talk" it's ok but everyone
has to learn fersteval
the structure of composing
mastering etc.!
5.) I read in this forum a good advice
2 break the rules u have 2 know the rules
pls do not ripp my head off it's
just my opinnion and i am a nobody !!! 
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Colin OOOD
Moderator
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Sep 12, 2006 20:34
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Bone_Flute, there are answers to all the points you made but in the interests of not wanting to seem argumentative I'll just answer one here:
"5) I read in this forum a good advice
2 break the rules u have 2 know the rules"
The only rule in psytrance used to be "Kickdrum on the beat". What happened to that incredible simplicity that gave rise to such intricate results? Make your own rules. Innovate. Don't be afraid for your experiments not to work, as you learn something new each time. The way you start your creative career has a great influence on the way it progresses - you think Posford started out trying to make tracks that copied someone else's structure? YOU could be the one to 'blow the scene wide open' - but that'll never happen if you're content to make tracks that sound like someone else.
Mastering - http://mastering.OOOD.net :: www.is.gd/mastering
OOOD 5th album 'You Think You Are' - www.is.gd/tobuyoood :: www.OOOD.net
www.facebook.com/OOOD.music :: www.soundcloud.com/oood
Contact for bookings/mastering - colin@oood.net |
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punkah
Started Topics :
6
Posts :
210
Posted : Sep 18, 2006 21:20
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.. you think Posford started out trying to make tracks that copied someone else's structure? YOU could be the one to 'blow the scene wide open' - but that'll never happen if you're content to make tracks that sound like someone else.
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enough said. |
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assaf_zo
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
46
Posts :
141
Posted : Sep 18, 2006 23:45
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damn the shit is still going on....
yeah belive it or not posford didnt start from scratch,
ohh no.. he got his ideas from others work and became what he is today by his own talent
NOBODY going to start by himself unless he learnd others work, and ideas, technics and so on
lets take phil colins he made the tape reverb work
and after that everybody used it, and became bigger
stop the bullshit please, and ppl learn structure learn others work... ppl keep talking about new sound this wasnt the main idea from begining
i guess u want to feel like superman invent the whole scene or a new scene but those kind of things
is made once in 20 to 10 years.
experiment is the real deal but if ur got the recipe that a better starting point to start the experiment
so punkah, no not enough said cause it seems like u didnt get what im talking about... try to open ur mind
if experiment wasnt a part of music i would start from the begining... but as time goes on i see i got to consider history
why theres a bride, or breaks or leads... those questions answers r in artists work there u can learn the best and from there build ur own realm
see ya, and make music for fun first
and dont be mad, thats whats everything is all about
if we take sience we cant start shaking stuff, we need to consider what is experiment before us... LEARN OTHERS WORK !!! the only way to go forward .
PEACE
HUGE BIG BLUE-MARVEL THAT WE LIVE ON |
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