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About comparing your tracks with pro ones
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PsyGalaXy
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Jan 16, 2010 06:19:54
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mquirk1
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Jan 16, 2010 06:49
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yeah in way he's right.. a perfect mastering session would preserve all the dynamics/sound of the mix, whilst basically just making it louder. i've heard many mastering 'jobs' where yeah it makes it louder but the mix really turns to shit. eqing should really be kept to a minimum on the master.. that is if the final mix is a good one. if you are mixing in a poor environment then it becomes more useful as the mastering engineer will (if they are pro) have a perfect sounding room and be in a better position to make eq choices. this is why more and more people are sending stems to be mastered instead of just a stereo mixdown.
to answer your original q though comparing your mix with a pro one is a great way to find out what needs work. like if you play a pro mix on your system and it sounds really crisp and clear, then you play one of your tracks and it's very muddy/bassy you know you have to cut some of the bass/boost the highs etc. if your monitoring chain/room isn't perfect then referencing your stuff to pro mixes is the best way to get a great mix.. |
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Seamoon
Seamoon
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Posted : Jan 16, 2010 13:17
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+1 mquirk1
but also i have to say don't try to sound exactly like your reference material because this is impossible. if you compare different commercial recordings you will notice that they also often sound very different from each other (they both sound great in a different way).
just try to get it best sounding on all systems, and if it sounds good to you on all systems then you did a good job....
 http://soundcloud.com/seamoon |
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orgytime
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Posted : Jan 16, 2010 13:50
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for me, comparing helped alot in the beginning, later it just frustrated me, because i couldnt get the perfect sound.
now i know a little bit about mastering and its less frustrating to me 
"the best mastering session is the one that involves no more than RMS level matching"
this is really just theoretical imo... mastering can make good sounds perfect. and thats why its frustrating to campare your track with a mastered peace.
only if you have good mastering knowledge, you can anticipate the mastering process while you are mixing your track. then you just have to "RMS level match" in the mastering process... and now tell me who can do this without a perfect mastering studio?
cheers www.soundcloud.com/orgytime |
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mquirk1
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Jan 16, 2010 16:42
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Quote:
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On 2010-01-16 13:17, Seamoon wrote:
+1 mquirk1
but also i have to say don't try to sound exactly like your reference material because this is impossible. if you compare different commercial recordings you will notice that they also often sound very different from each other (they both sound great in a different way).
just try to get it best sounding on all systems, and if it sounds good to you on all systems then you did a good job....
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yeah that's true. you are better off using just one track as your reference one. or at least having a 'sound' in mind when you start to mix a track and have a pro track with that 'sound' that you can compare with. if you try and compare to multiple tracks you'll just drive yourself crazy as, as Seamoon said, different tracks sound 'good' in different ways. there is no single 'right' mix (that's not to say there aren't 'wrong' ones though  )
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mquirk1
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
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Posted : Jan 16, 2010 16:52
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Quote:
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"the best mastering session is the one that involves no more than RMS level matching"
this is really just theoretical imo... mastering can make good sounds perfect. and thats why its frustrating to campare your track with a mastered peace.
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i don't really agree. i think people expect too much of mastering.. ie compare their tracks to pro ones and be like "oh my track in comparison doesn't sound that good because they've been mastered". if you listen to some a/b of real pro mixes before and after mastering, everything that makes the mastered version awesome is already there in the mix.. mastering is, for the most part, just squeezing every last db out of it without the mix falling apart. this is harder then it sounds and why the top dudes get paid a shitload.
mastering is for the most part making it loud whilst minimising the damage that doing so has on the mix.. it's not like you can take a subpar track get it mastered and suddenly it will sound huge |
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orgytime
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Jan 16, 2010 23:20
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PsyGalaXy
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Jan 17, 2010 06:01
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mrquirk u nailed it
my environement really sucks balls (altough my mixing skills too), it's a squared 2*3m with very low and irregular ceiling in downtown
plus i've made the big mistake to buy 8" monitor two years ago (tapco s8)
so the best way to go it's comparing with the pros,
the ideal utopian thing is to have a unmastered pro track, just out the mix ,but i don't have
so
i put the pro track in a channel and raise down the level approx to -20RMS ,
or
stick an heavy ad-limiter on mine to raise the -10RMS of the pros, and here comes out the shit..
snare distorts, cymbals cut ears, stationery freqs masks other leads, and when i tear down with multiband it cleans but also make sounds thinner
i do all this 'cause i assume the mastering guy will raise mine to -10rms, but certainly not sticking a limiter like i do..
i'm angry with myself cause my mixing problems shift away the listener's attention from my ideas to the bad sound
what's the rightest one in your opinions fellows psyheads?
down the pro or up the mine?
it's a long way again for Jonny http://mystic-sound.com/releases/ioon-cosmic-downtempo-9314-oclock/
FREE DOWNLOAD EKTO http://www.ektoplazm.com/free-music/ioon-the-ioonfinite-loop
https://spiritedrecords.bandcamp.com/album/times-of-peace-2
https://soundcloud.com/opalmoonproj |
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nonseq
Started Topics :
0
Posts :
18
Posted : Jan 17, 2010 18:15
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So which tracks do you guys use as a reference?
Personally I like Koxbox but some sounds on the last CD really cross the line into painful-sound territory (maybe around 8k). I don't know what would be a good reference for pretty loud but nice on the ears... |
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zebu connection
Started Topics :
1
Posts :
131
Posted : Jan 18, 2010 07:23
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the best way for a beedroom producer is knowing a pro master lab! |
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
162
Posts :
8087
Posted : Jan 18, 2010 22:35
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it s limiting but maybe use as reference the tracks that are released on the labels you want to sell/give tracks ,some labels try to develop their own sounds, production is/can be a part of it |
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mquirk1
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
63
Posts :
384
Posted : Jan 19, 2010 17:52
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Quote:
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On 2010-01-17 06:01, PsyGalaXy wrote:
mrquirk u nailed it
my environement really sucks balls (altough my mixing skills too), it's a squared 2*3m with very low and irregular ceiling in downtown
plus i've made the big mistake to buy 8" monitor two years ago (tapco s8)
so the best way to go it's comparing with the pros,
the ideal utopian thing is to have a unmastered pro track, just out the mix ,but i don't have
so
i put the pro track in a channel and raise down the level approx to -20RMS ,
or
stick an heavy ad-limiter on mine to raise the -10RMS of the pros, and here comes out the shit..
snare distorts, cymbals cut ears, stationery freqs masks other leads, and when i tear down with multiband it cleans but also make sounds thinner
i do all this 'cause i assume the mastering guy will raise mine to -10rms, but certainly not sticking a limiter like i do..
i'm angry with myself cause my mixing problems shift away the listener's attention from my ideas to the bad sound
what's the rightest one in your opinions fellows psyheads?
down the pro or up the mine?
it's a long way again for Jonny
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lower the reference track. when you are mixing make sure all the channels are around -20 RMS. and that's -20 input gain, not output. ths is to make sure nothing clips when they are running through plugins etc.. but yeah, don't try and put a limiter or something on your master just to up the level so you can compare to pro tracks. mixing in to a limiter is bad news, cos when you take it off the mix will sound completely different..
as fo reference tracks. i think, in the fullon world at least, krome angels production is hard to beat |
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