Nomad Moon
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Posted : Jul 2, 2013 18:25
Quote:
On 2013-07-02 15:35, PoM wrote:
that psytrance that should inspire techno and house producer...
In the early 2000's this is was what was happening
Tudo que é melhor e mais superior em mim saúda tudo que é melhor e mais alto em si
jekvan
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Posted : Jul 2, 2013 18:56
And it will rise,once again!!
Here is the stuff I tried till now,with some success :
1)432 Hz mode instead of 440 . Does have a different vibe for it.
2) Functional harmony . Today producers have no idea that it is supposed to create tension and release. They try some chords that sound good as themselves. But not as a time function,where dissonant chords played to create tension over time,to be released. I tried this in my last track also to a good success.
There are more then enough tutorials about classical music and how functional harmony works . Most note that this is western way of harmony,I gathered there is different way for example in Indian music . Must explore this as well.
3)Time signature and polyrhythms :
Writing peace of music not in 4/4 but other time signature . My last one was 5/4 which gives it very weird feel , but the weird feel I gather comes from a lot of time listening to 4/4 .
Shpongle actually has a track in 5/4 . I forgot its name ,but it has rather a good flow . Most famous 5/4 track was "take five " ,listen to it,it is the bomb jazz. The jizz in pants jazz.
And polyrhythms is combining different time signatures of rhythm , in the same play . It is widely done in African music . Very weird stuff,very nice once you get it .
I have to say that this stuff sounds weird at first play,but this is because music is cultural and mnemonic - you like music because you heard it once ,and at some time it made you feel good . What you have never heard is dismissed at first as weird,and it takes several hearings .
4)Expression in music - recording myself (using my cellphone ,lol ) talking about stuff that disturbs me. Psy doesn't have to be about drugs . Fuck,most of the people who use psychedelia do not know how to work with what they saw after . They saw alternative way of thinking ,but when they come back they do not know or want to work with it . How to change the unjustice . How to express the unjustice . What does it mean to be part of one ,and how far we are from it , why is that ,and what needs to be changed?
Talking about drugs in psytrance is like talking about spices in cooking show - they are important ingredients but they are not the product . Musicians can be like a teachers and role models for people ,so who we are if all we talk about is how it is good to do drugs ?
Blues,which is my most beloved expression music,talks a lot about what folks find difficult . Rock and psychedelic rock talks a lot about social unjustice .
Anyway,talking / trying my best of thinging and then using waves tune (pitch correction) to correct it into the notes of the track . Slicing my talk which is now sounds like weird singing,warping it , and putting a lot of effects on the channel to mask the horrible result .
This track for example .
From all the things I lost,that sandwitch cost me most :)
OzMike
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Posted : Jul 3, 2013 04:50
Polyrhythms are great if done properly. It's the reason I still listen to heavy metal. Messhugah make amazing complex music that is wonderful to trance out to. The only metal band I still actively listen to.
Cuntus Maximus.
TimeTraveller
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Posted : Jul 3, 2013 08:25
Quote:
On 2013-07-03 04:50, OzMike wrote:
Polyrhythms are great if done properly.
On 2013-07-02 01:55, makus wrote:
mix genres. express yourself. don't listen to music too much - create new. play instruments. quantize rarely
Some of my thoughts there... especially I'd say don't listen to (too) much psytrance! I don't know if psytrance would benefit from loose quantisation however; hard quantise on most sounds in a track seems to me as fundamental to the genre as the kick drum is.
Indeed, psytrance definitely needs hard quantize. In fact non quntized stuff will sound out of timing in most cases. I make other musics besides psy and many rules I gained thru experience in psy just don't fit to other genres. I found out that some instrumental soundtrack becomes more alive without hard quantization. All those drums humanizers and random quantization might help. Unfortunately I am a really bad keyboard player and can't play what I want like kevin kenner But I found a way around it that helps me enlive and animate arps and leads and some percussion in Cubase:
great!
Tudo que é melhor e mais superior em mim saúda tudo que é melhor e mais alto em si
frisbeehead
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Jul 3, 2013 17:14
Quote:
On 2013-07-03 10:40, makus wrote:
Quote:
On 2013-07-03 02:13, Colin OOOD wrote:
Quote:
On 2013-07-02 01:55, makus wrote:
mix genres. express yourself. don't listen to music too much - create new. play instruments. quantize rarely
Some of my thoughts there... especially I'd say don't listen to (too) much psytrance! I don't know if psytrance would benefit from loose quantisation however; hard quantise on most sounds in a track seems to me as fundamental to the genre as the kick drum is.
Indeed, psytrance definitely needs hard quantize. In fact non quntized stuff will sound out of timing in most cases. I make other musics besides psy and many rules I gained thru experience in psy just don't fit to other genres. I found out that some instrumental soundtrack becomes more alive without hard quantization. All those drums humanizers and random quantization might help. Unfortunately I am a really bad keyboard player and can't play what I want like kevin kenner But I found a way around it that helps me enlive and animate arps and leads and some percussion in Cubase:
interesting, I do the same in Logic. Can post equivalent screenshot later if anyone's interested
I've done a track or two where the keybed action I played sounded better without hard quantization and it's a real fast psytrance track, depends on the feel. My experience on that is: works better with natural sounding envelopes, so adjusting the release to suit the style of playing is key for good sounding, not quantized phrases, even for psytrance. But trully depends on what we're doing though.
What about getting away from the psy bass thing? Someone should put out a contest for that. I can't because I can't put no money on that XD
PoM
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Posted : Jul 3, 2013 19:11
no quantitzation = groove for me
not related but the transient are placed some millissecond later the quantization while the kick is not,for really tight groovy beat it help to adjust everything in the track by ears to the kick.
jekvan
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Posted : Jul 3, 2013 19:11
Quote:
What about getting away from the psy bass thing? Someone should put out a contest for that. I can't because I can't put no money on that XD
Tricky one,this is the most driving part of the track.You can sustain entire croud by just kick and bass.
Maybe treat it more like a melodic element,and trying to write melody for it,instead of lead melody ?
This means serious work,cause usually bass notes sound good for just small interval and then you have to make different bass line if you want to sample large range of bass notes.
Some reversal : Treat your bass as melodic line,and your melodic line as a rythmical pattern instead.
Write long bass melodic pattern (most probably one has to sample each note and put it into multisampler,cause you have to tweak seriously each bass note to make it sound good over range).Write 4 bars of simple groove for some stab,maybe even just one note.
From all the things I lost,that sandwitch cost me most :)
vector_0
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Posted : Jul 3, 2013 19:15
well, the way I see it, psytrance is essentially just one riff that lots of producers have been jamming on for over 10 years.
if you want to make trance, then make trance. you have to follow a formula if you want it to be considered as such.
if you want to innovate, stop making trance. don't use the same drum pattern and approximate tempo on every track. no more 4-on-the-floor. maybe use some *gasp* real instruments, vocals, etc. spend some time listening to jazz, rock, rap, folk, acoustic, etc to get your mind away from "thump thump thump thump, repeat"
I think the whole space/future music is beginning to sound a bit passé, to be honest. we aren't living in the star trek universe, and there's still lots of organic experience in this world at every turn, despite our technology. instead of looking to the future, maybe think more about the present.
also, maybe think about "fun" instead of all this trance stuff being so "serious" psychedelic. psychedelics can be a lot of fun, but everything i hear from psychedelic trance has no element of fun...its like the artist is shaking me by the shoulders saying "this is so mystical!!"
I like trance at parties, but I can't imagine being satisfied as an artist if my music was almost totally indistinguishable from so many other tracks.
http://soundcloud.com/rob-vector
Colin OOOD
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Posted : Jul 3, 2013 20:33
Quote:
On 2013-07-03 19:11, jekvan wrote:
Some reversal : Treat your bass as melodic line,and your melodic line as a rythmical pattern instead.
Write long bass melodic pattern (most probably one has to sample each note and put it into multisampler,cause you have to tweak seriously each bass note to make it sound good over range).Write 4 bars of simple groove for some stab,maybe even just one note.
Melange5738
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Posted : Jul 3, 2013 20:47
For me the trick is to keep it as a hobby but who am I to say it can't be a profession. To me it seems like there is just a few albums every year that I even consider buying as most of it seems like I have heard it before even when I hear it the first time.
<3
But I found a way around it that helps me enlive and animate arps and leads and some percussion in Cubase: 
